Summary
Chinese President Xi Jinping reiterated in his New Year’s speech that Taiwan’s “reunification” with China is inevitable.
China has escalated military activity around Taiwan, including frequent incursions near the island and sanctions on U.S.-linked companies over arms sales to Taipei.
Taiwanese President Lai Ching-te rejected Beijing’s claims, stating Taiwan’s future can only be decided by its people.
Lai also criticized China’s restrictions on travel and education exchanges with Taiwan, calling for dignified, reciprocal relations based on goodwill and equality.
Totally not imperialism trust me bro.
I mean…It ain’t? Taiwan, the Kuomintang, were literally the imperialists. Taiwan was always China but China changed and…yeah modern china should probably leave Taiwan alone because it’s literally the old chinese government but 100 years later, but they won’t, their government actually thinks in millenia
At some point Poland held Moscow for a year. We need to get it back I guess. We like to think in milenia as well.
Reunification? Taiwan was never a part of communist China.
Just because Taiwan was part of an empire that has common roots with communist China is no reason at all.
Let’s not use their propaganda and call them communist. Communist leadership wouldn’t have fascist allies around the world
man that is a ridiculous amount of lies in very few words. nice show.
It’s gross how they always refer to these things as “reunifying”.
I got news for you. The Republic of China also uses that same language.
Why isn’t that an appropriate term? It was part of China’s (Qing) territory from 1684 until the Japanese occupations, and is only disunified because of an unresolved civil war. Taiwan (officially the “Republic of China”) considers themself to be China. So why wouldn’t their combination be the reunification of China?
Taiwan was never part of current China though and does not want to be absorbed into that state. Reunification doesn’t sound right for what China would have to do to make it happen.
Reunification doesn’t sound right
It’s an objective term for when states join into a single state, like the unification of Italy for example. It’s not about approval or disapproval, I’m not taking a side by calling it reunification.
The re- prefix does have implications that go beyond any two states becoming one. Germany’s case is a bit different anyway because it was external forces splitting the country.
Taiwan was never part of current China though
The same was true for East and West Germany and that, err, merger is generally considered to be a reunification.
But I agree with the rest you wrote, so I guess it’s a moot point anway.
But west germany did not invade east germany…
I mean, true, but that doesn’t contradict what I wrote, does it? I objected to that particular part of kshades argument, not their argument as a whole.
It’s a fair argument, I wouldn’t call South or North Korea forcefully annexing the other reunification either though. One state would be annihilated, both in terms of its institutions and its culture. There’s no unity in that, it’s conquest.
But maybe my view of the word is colored by German history. I don’t know, it’s just that calling what would be a horrible, grueling war “reunification” doesn’t seem right, like an attempt at white-washing what would actually happen. Reminds me a bit too much of Putin’s claims about Ukraine.
If you want something that doesn’t want you- what do YOU call it?
What’s that got to do with anything? It’s still called a reunification even if both sides didn’t want it. There was a whole entity, it split, and if it joins back together then that’s called reunifying it.
rape
envy.
Get your authoritarian ass outta here😂
Not an authoritarian, not even taking a side. I’m pointing out that unification is the term for resolving partitions to form a single state.
Uh,
From 1949 to 1987, the KMT ruled Taiwan as an authoritarian one-party state after the February 28 incident.
So its no longer an authoritarian government for 38 years now. Thanks for pointing that out!
In the mean time Xi is serving his 3rd term in PRC right now, or 4th? Ignoring the rules set up by his predecessors. And you think that’s better?
Even the UN 🇺🇳 doesn’t recognize Taiwan 🇹🇼.
Because China holds a veto power. What’s your point? China won’t allow Taiwan to join a club that China’s partially in control of. In other news, water is wet.
Interesting, the ROC doesn’t hold veto power? How can China join the club, if Taiwan is the rightful government representing all the Chinese people?
Nor does the US or Taiwan
I think “invasion” would be the correct term here.
You can use both terms, there’s no contradiction.
Consider the US civil war. The Confederates were (rightfully) invaded and plenty of them still aren’t happy about it, the result was still the unification of the ‘northern’ and the ‘southern’ states.
Instance checks out
Got it, let’s help continental China adopt modern and true democracy then!
Work on your own imperialist fucking country first. Jesus fucking Christ you libs are insufferable.
Bro please move to .ml there are dozens of you there
Wow, China’s propaganda in plain view in this comments section, damn!
Tankies gon’ tank.
Tankies gonna downvote too. They think they are anonymous in the votes haha
We need public downvotes
They already are
Yeah, some of 'em. Most of them are just regular Chinese people repeating what they’ve been told, though. I’ve talked with all kinds of Chinese people like that, and truly, when I’m not being a dick about it, it is amazing how quickly I can change their minds. “Quickly” here means “in a month”. Not during the first conversation. Be gentle.
And these people are willingly kissing his ass. They’re not even Chinese people who actually grew up with propaganda, but instead make the conscious choice to believe it.
The quickest way to do this is for the CCP to surrender to the ROC.
great so that means the CCP is stepping down and letting the ROC government back into Beijing to govern a reunified China? Excellent news if true.
Imagine being the type of loser that would downvote comments in support of a country refusing to be overthrown.
You’d think we’d have learned by now, but here we are.
Here’s for hoping these kids manage to become aware of their ignorance by the time they hit high school.
same vibe
Okay, West Taiwan.
Get the sentiment, but just a friendly reminder that most Taiwanese people don’t love the “West Taiwan” meme as it props up the outdated idea that Taiwan wants to make a claim to China, when the vast majority are in favor of just being left alone. This isn’t two aggressors laying claim to each other, it’s one threatening the other.
Sounds like something south Canada would say.
You mean North Mexico?
Don’t do that.
Don’t give me hope.
Not North America?
Oh wait…
Sounds rather rapey when you put it that way, doesn’t it?
Very. But I still expect to see plenty of hypocritical leninists ignoring or defending this. Telling us that Daddy Xi is only killing them for their own good. And that if they just lay back and took it that they would learn to enjoy it.
Not that it’s ever made sense that they defend certain capitalists. While denouncing capitalism and other capitalist governments.
I worry for the future generations of Taiwan and Ukraine. Trump’s going to just shrug and let them die.
“Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.”
You mean… “Reunified.” Think of it like Russia’s “special military operation” only with less genocide.
Definitely not something an imperialist would say.
Yes. “reuninifcation”.
Just like Austria was “reunified” with Nazi germany. 🤮
I mean that was also reunification. Doesn’t make it a good thing, but it fits the definition of reunification.
Reading up a bit on the history of China, it looks like the Communists won the war for power in the nation and those who were supported by the West fled to Taiwan.
A better comparison would be if the Confederates fled to an island and retained their independence after losing the American civil war.
You need to keep in mind, the capitalists lost. You can live in la-la land thinking they “should have” won, but that’s simply not what happened.
Capitalist lost? You seen modern day China? Hardly anti-capitalist. Taiwan should get to decide if it’s part of China or not. Doesn’t seam they want undemocratic dystopia.
Going to your America example, the Brits withdrew to Canada. You with Trump with invading Canada then? A 1812 rematch?
I dont get the downvotes. China is state controlled capitalism with all the negatives of capitalism like extreme wealth disparity. China couldnt be further from a stateless, classless moneyless society that communism aspires.
There are a lot of similarities between the PRC’s economic model and the NEP, but this doesn’t mean it’s Capitalist, nor is it accurate to say it has all of the negatives of Capitalism. The PRC is in the early stages of Socialism, and this is shown through strong government control of the Private Sector, a robust and expansive Public Sector, and large-scale Central Planning. You’re correct that it is far from being Stateless, Classless, or Moneyless, but at the same time you have to acknowledge that they simply can’t push the “Communism button” and establish a global Republic of full Public Ownership and Central Planning and an established system of labor vouchers or other such non-money form of accounting.
The process of building Communism is long and drawn out after the revolution, and must be a global process as well.
Yes, all Socialist societies should work towards the eventual end of commodity production, however neither Marx nor Engels figured that it could be done away with immediately. From Principles of Communism:
Question 17 : Will it be possible to abolish private property at one stroke?
Answer : No, no more than the existing productive forces can at one stroke be multiplied to the extent necessary for the creation of a communal society. Hence, the proletarian revolution, which in all probability is approaching, will be able gradually to transform existing society and abolish private property only when the necessary means of production have been created in sufficient quantity.
From Socialism: Utopian and Scientific:
The first act in which the state really comes forward as the representative of the whole of society – the taking possession of the means of production in the name of society – is at the same time its last independent act as a state. The interference of the state power in social relations becomes superfluous in one sphere after another, and then dies away of itself. The government of persons is replaced by the administration of things and the direction of the processes of production. The state is not “abolished”, it withers away. It is by this that one must evaluate the phrase “a free people’s state” with respect both to its temporary agitational justification and to its ultimate scientific inadequacy, and it is by this that we must also evaluate the demand of the so-called anarchists that the state should be abolished overnight.
Ultimately, it remains a contradiction that eventually the PRC will have to do away with. However, this is a gradual process that can only be accomplished through trial and error. There is a Chinese proverb often referenced in the CPC, that “one must cross the river by feeling for the stones,” and this reflects their cautious strategy. Moreover, we must understand that the USSR fell, and the CPC saw that in real time. Not wanting to repeat the Cultural Revolution nor the fall of the USSR, the CPC adjusted their practice. It remains to be seen what will happen in 10, 20, 50, 100 years, of course, but currently the CPC is behaving in a manner we can understand as Marxist.
The USSR was just as capitalist as the PRC. Because it had generalized commodity production and wage-labor. You can’t have a socialist mode of production in just one country, as the interaction with capitalist countries will infect your system.
The PRC is a highly technocratic advanced capitalist democracy, and yes, it will likely outpace the west in a number of key statistics over time, that doesn’t make it socialist, because the productive mode is capitalism.
You with Trump with invading Canada then? A 1812 rematch?
Oh no, please don’t give that bloated orange Slurm mascot any more ideas.
The official position in both countries is that there is “one China” and that they are the legitimate one.
Unlike in mainland China in Taiwan people including most of the political elite seem to be fine with the status quo though.
I think they are both best just signing mutual recognition and moving on. Neither is the same as they where when they seperated.
everyone in Taiwan would love to do that, but Beijing can’t get over being dumped.
Having markets and Private Property doesn’t mean a country isn’t dedicated to Socialism and eventual full public ownership. Rather, Marx and Engels maintained that even heavily developed countries could not immediately publicly own and plan all production, but that after the revolution this would be a gradual process. Focusing too much on Class Struggle and not on industrial development (which allows the Class Struggle to be accelerated as the more an industry develops the easier it is to plan it, a central observation about Capitalism that led Marx to predict the next mode of production to be Socialism), is a dogmatic mistake that led to the excesses in the Cultural Revolution.
Either way, back to the US, a more apt comparison would be decolonization and land-back for Indigenous Peoples, same with Canada.
Your saying it’s not capitalist and it clearly is now.
For the US example, it’s not comparable if you go back to Indigenous Peoples. That’s a whole other thing.
What do you mean by China is “clearly Capitalist?” What do you think Capitalism and Socialism are?
“Capitalism is an economic system based on the private ownership of the means of production and their operation for profit.”
This applies to modern China.
Communism’s brief doesn’t fit modern China “a socioeconomic order centered around common ownership of the means of production, distribution, and exchange that allocates products to everyone in society based on need.”
Private Ownership isn’t the basis of the PRC’s economy, though. The PRC isn’t at Communism yet, either, rather they are Socialist. The base of their economy is in the Public Sector with strong state control over the Private Sector.
To ask this in another way, are you of the belief that a “single drop” of Capitalism makes the system Capitalist? The natural conclusion to that is that neither “Capitalism” nor “Socialism” has ever existed. This is obviously wrong, of course, the answer is that the system is determined by the sector with power over the economy.
Keep reading, because you haven’t gotten it yet. The communists rebelled against the KMT government and pushed them out to Taiwan. The American analogy would be if the south had won the civil war and pushed the north back to, let’s say, Long Island.
personally, if the confederates f off to their own island, I would let them stay on that island, as long as they don’t influence back.
That’s a lazy and inaccurate take. The Chinese Civil War wasn’t some simplistic ‘capitalists vs. communists’ fight. The KMT was corrupt but not purely capitalist, and the CCP’s victory came from exploiting peasant dissatisfaction and the KMT’s failures, not some inherent ideological supremacy. Comparing the KMT to the Confederacy is absurd—they weren’t separatists but nationalists fighting for control of all China. If you’re going to push historical narratives, at least try for accuracy instead of ideological grandstanding.
K, I don’t use all caps a lot, but I DON’T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT THE CHINESE CIVIL WAR.
I will not be a slave to history. My defense of Taiwan is entirely based on the here and now.
K I need to qualify that statement somewhat. History is useful for explaining why the world is the way it is today, and serves as a guide into the future, but it is useless as some kind of long term score sheet.
Well, if that’s how you want to see it then the idea of “rightful owner” doesn’t matter much.
It’s really just who you like more at that point.
It’s not that the rightful owner doesn’t matter. It’s that it is hard to quantify on this scale, and it is especially hard to quantify using history.
And yeah, it is in fact more about who I like more. I like the Taiwanese government because the Taiwanese people are in control of it, and I believe in every human’s right to choose their own government. I hate the Chinese government for exactly the same reason, along with the fact that they’re a bunch of land grabbing imperialist bastards.
I’m glad you can admit your bias and that your idea of who China belongs to is based on personal preference.
I’m glad you can admit that you consider human rights as a form of personal preference.
But my, uh, “preference” for human rights isn’t actually the highest principle at play here. The highest principle here is that of internationally-agreed-upon borders. A country may not violate these borders. Period. For example, even though I like Taiwan’s government more, I do not believe they deserve one square metre of mainland China.
That’s weird, I thought China has currency and all sorts of other capitalist systems.
With the declining population and the slowing down of the chinese economy, he should be more concerned about improving their economy otherwise the Chinese population will give him mussolini treatment.
Are we sure this “China” is a real country?
Call it by it’s name, mainland Taiwan.
West Taiwan
That works too
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