a series that most people like to forget it existed which contradict so much aspects of normal trek. followed by picard, than academy and snw. kurtzman or his protege should really stop making trek.
Agreed
Tuvok catching Seska sneaking a soup to Chakotay: Sorry, I must confiscate this soup. It will get us home faster.
to steal his dna to make a baby, who ended being kazon.
But then you would never have had Leola Root Stew (substitute coffee, substitute chowder, substitute warp plasma, there’s nothing it can’t substitute) and can that truly be called living?
Don’t forget about spicy Plomek soup and ship wrecking Mac ‘n’ Cheese.
Discovery should have been set in the future of the series. Then not only would the RIDICULOUSLY HUGE AMOUNT OF EMPTY SPACE in the ship would make more sense, the advanced tech would make more sense, and most importantly, they wouldn’t need to retcon ANYTHING.
They just wanted to be able to use certain characters and wanted to be set before almost anything else. So they did the dumb thing and placed the advanced future ship in the past.
discovery was pretty much doomed from the start when they use spore drive as a “Secret” that violates the stark trek continuity.
No, Discovery should have been a post-Dominion war show, and had nothing to do with a Spore drive, or Spock.
picard is that post-dominion show, but its almost as bad as discovery. remember they were suppose to have a borg alliance in season 2 and the romulan threat in season 1 and the mysterious rift, until they dropped it completely in the 3rd season. and the same thing happened at the end of Lower decks with the rift thing.
No, I mean like a normal show about a regular crew, over multiple seasons, not a fan service one-off that kind of touches on it, but that’s not really the point. And Picard seasons 1 and 2 were shit. Season 2 was fucking awful, and I don’t care about the rift. I want to know what happened to the universe I was invested in for 21 goddamn seasons.
Discovery should have been an all holodeck show starting Moriarty as The Captain.
Also fuck you autocarrot like many a lonely pirate I will not use homosexualidad as a replacement for holodeck. Even though I still agree.
It’s not like you can’t make an early-timeline modern show without making a bunch of weird conflicts, retcons, and anachronisms. Strange New Worlds is great and sticks pretty well to the canon tech, styles, and sigh Klingon physical appearance as the original canon (or Next Gen canon for the Klingons) with slick modern production, design and writing. But they wanted an early-timeline show with advanced late-Trek tech, unique species designs, and muddled in with established characters. They wanted their cake and to eat it too. It isn’t a bad show, but from the very beginning they wrote themselves into having to later recon the entire show out of the annals of Trek History or else all of the canon would make no sense.
i remember when Star Wars: The Clone Wars came out and they introduced Ahsoka. i wasn’t online then so maybe people on message boards called that a retcon too, but to me and my kid friends it was obvious something happens to her taking her out of play by Revenge of the Sith. it was interesting and cool and gave the show a sense of tension, knowing when the bomb drops isn’t a matter of if but when
that’s essentially the same thing Discovery was doing introducing this ship and technology that’s gone by TOS. you can argue whether or not it’s good storytelling- i think both Clone Wars and Discovery didn’t quite stick the landing in a few places despite loving the former and generally liking the latter- but none of that was retconning, just non-linear storytelling
It goes beyond just this ship and the tech that is isolated to it. They also establish events, organizations and technology that is used widely throughout the federation that they also have to shoehorn in a way to explain why it is never referenced or used again.
Like the holograms are really prevalent in long range communications. After the conflict with Control where the AI is able to impersonate an admiral with faked hologram imaging, they casually throw out a line about how they’ll never use that tech anymore as it isn’t trustworthy (and thus aligning with the established canon). Like not “we need to put in more safeguards”, “we need to only accept orders through official verifiable channels”, or “this tech should only be used for casual communication with family and friends”, etc. Just “Welp that tech was cool, but fool me once! Never again! No holograms for you! Also, the existence of Control is also being buried and made illegal to talk about, so we can’t even explain why this tech being used all over starfleet is being shut down completely and immediately.” That is a purely nonsensical outcome that they wrote themselves into just becuase they wanted largely cosmetic tech earlier than it should have existed.
Yeah, it’s easy to have a prequel character that doesn’t show up in the original and have that make sense, but technology is much harder to explain away. You generally need some form of major societal collapse to explain why tech in a prequel isn’t around anymore. So long as anyone knows how to make the tech, it will come back. Even someone just being aware that the tech existed can result in someone reinventing it.
This isn’t too difficult to accomplish if the setting is before the information age to begin with, but it’s much harder to justify if the internet or an equivalent is around. We lost the secret of how to make concrete for about a thousand years following the collapse of Rome. On the other hand, David Hahn built a nuclear reactor in his home with just books from the library. Those books are now available any time you want on that neat rectangle you keep in your pocket, and we know from experience that you can’t really scrub anything from the internet, so they’ll always be there so long as the internet still exists.
Somewhere out there on the Klingon portion (and probably the Romulan portion) of Trek’s internet equivalent are detailed accounts of the USS Discovery, her crew, and her spore drive. The ship was operating completely in the open, after all. And since the Klingons never classified that info, it would be easily and readily available to anyone who can read Klingon or has access to a universal translator.
Yeah, I wasn’t going to touch on the spore drive because they really seemed to be playing on the idea that it took the singular genius of Stamets to create it… except his genius wasn’t singular. He had a research partner, Straal.
Yes, Straal died and Stamets went to the future, but whatever groundwork science existed for their research to even get off the ground still existed for other scientists to build on. And they started this research in a classified lab, sure, but surely others in the lab knew about it. And it only took 6 months after the technology was co-opted by Starfleet for the war effort to be fully functional in two separate ships, so they must have been pretty far along by the time they left the lab too. Two separate human scientists of about the same age who knew each other were able to found the groundwork from existing science and tech and work independently on developing the technology on two different ships… so the likelihood that they were just uniquely qualified and no one else could do it is extremely unlikely.
As you said, the spore drive was used openly and effectively in the war and the Klingons and others certainly knew about the capabilities of it, as well as some details of its nature. And even if the existing research and memory of the Discovery was successfully buried in the federation, the scientific knowledge it was based on was not. The scientific principles upon which the tech was built could be rediscovered eventually, especially if people had an idea of it’s usefulness (putting it mildly).
Given the technology would literally be a paradigm shifting technology as much or moreso as warp technology was, there is absolutely no way that the tech wouldn’t be pursued by someone… eventually… Yet 1000 years later, and Discovery is still uniquely capable of essentially teleportation in the entire galaxy, at at time when interstellar travel has become critically difficult. It’s value is beyond priceless. Even the fact that future Starfleet isn’t immediately using it to build more is mind boggling… or that the past starfleet didn’t either for that matter…
They could have kept the knowledge of the spore tech even if they had to hide the existence of the Discovery. It was the ship itself that was the host of the Sphere data, not the spore tech. It stretches believability for sure that Starfleet didn’t do what it could to preserve this technology which could see them extending their INSTANTANEOUS reach to the entire galaxy.
And if they were going to pretend it never existed for inexplicable reasons, they could have at least made the cover up believable by doing something like planting false scientific data around the technology, poisoning the well to prevent others from discovering it for a long time. But no, they just say “shhh” and it goes away for a millenia.
So was this technology just singularly impossible to recreate? Was it sheer dumb luck that it was created at all? Is it impossible to reverse engineer? Or did the writers just fail to think of a good way to explain why the tech never reoccurred in 1000 years? 🙄
keeping the spore drive secret from star trek universe seems very unusual , at some point they would find evidence of it in thier databaes in the future. in 1000years they shouldve have known about transwarp/slipstream and other various methods of transportation, why were they still in WARP TECH.
lets not forget the manchild kelpian with the scream(fans were calling the person) that caused the burn.
On the other hand, David Hahn built a nuclear reactor in his home with just books from the library.
That’s a bit of a stretch; he never got anywhere near criticality, nor did he build any control systems or mechanisms to get useful energy out of it. Some of the earliest nuclear reactors were called “atomic piles,” but a pile of radioactive stuff is literally all that his was.
it’s almost like you want me to repeat myself about disco making more sense if you assume they’re just tripping space balls off space spores.
This fucking show with the mucous space ship engine. It’s just so un-Star Trek and bullshit. The whole show premise was based on horseshit.
Voyager used bioneural gel packs instead of isolinear circuitry. The ship caught the flu once
Two (arguably bad) episodes compared to entire seasons exploring the fucking mushroom drive 😩
actually twice. the giant viruses and neelix cheeses. they explained it was a valid reason to use it, superior than normal circuitry.
and have a human size tardigrade as a lifeform for the "spore dimension? kurtzman probably doesnt want to show in-warp travel anymore, i dont think any of the jj abrams ever showed in-warp travel/scenes often.
If I don’t get my timeline mixed up Discover never existed during Voyager’s time. They went to the future during Pike’s time. The drive was never revisited probably because the expert on it was now in the future.
Ooh that makes sense now! /s
Yea … I tried watching Disco recently and surprisingly enjoyed myself … until like episode 3 or whatever when Stamets first explains the spore drive. Then I realised that for me Disco was dead on arrival just because of that damn spore drive.
the series was so bad, the fact it went past 2 season is a miracle, by the 3rd-4th one they mostly eliminated all the male characthers from the show.
Even if you get past the spore drive the whole series is still full of contrived garbage with 1 or 2 decent episodes total
the continuity issues is what caused so much cirnge, Klingons having cloaking tech century before they were suppose to get it from the romulans, plus thier appearance is very unklingon-like, they look like xindi reptilians.
they followed the whole convoluted bs, ending a big bad in the end of the season which turns out to be a letdown every season.
I watched the whole show, and while I wouldn’t describe the series as good, they had a few good episodes. My favorite is s5e6 “Whistlespeak”
The one with the sphere seemed to be a good classic-trek style episode.
Agreed, I like that one too
I enjoyed Stamets until they made him nice.
they end up pushing him into the background by 2nd-3rd season until he dint do anything notable anymore in favor of the female leads which are kinda bad at acting.
A torpedo on a timer could do the same.
The captain asking a Starfleet officer to make that ultimate sacrifice for the crew would do the same.
Chuck it on the plot hole pile.
Something something section 31, spore drive, organic navigator, gel packs…
Okay, so. The Delta Quadrant is simply a quartered section of the Milky Way galaxy, yeah? Voyager finds itself there and has to travel for 75 years to get home, yeah? Assuming the ST maps out there are accurate, all of the quadrants are basically the same size. So this suggests that travel in either the Beta or Alpha Quadrants could involve super lengthy timelines like this.
I guess what I’m trying to get at is why VOY makes such a big deal out of the 75 years to get to the Alpha Quadrant when getting there might also involve another several decades of travel after crossing the “border.” Sure, there are allies and all that. But it’s still deep space. Like, the closest point between the quadrants is going to be near the galactic center/core (or are they accounting for the spin of the Milky Way and are thus traveling against that, so as to bring “home” closer while they themselves travel toward it?). So if it takes 75 years from their location in “Caretaker” to get to the core, then they’re looking at a similar amount of travel to Earth or whatever, right? Or did I miss something where they said that it would take 75 years to get to Earth?
they barely explored the delta quadrant by the time voyager was running to get home so much potential arcs in that quadrant. even the gamma quadrant has some things that are unexplored.
a show based in the gamma quadrant after the Dominion War would be kinda cool (if done right). That’s a show that could appeal to long-term fans while also potentially drawing in new ones because it would like TOS (and what VOY was originally supposed to be) in that there’s new worlds and cultures to be seen.
The caretakers array that pulled them to the Delta quadrant is located 70,000 lightyears from earth.
And apparently if you do it 47 times in a small area you can just between the mirror and prime universe
Spores must flow.
