Hello, maybe it’s out of scope of this community, but it’s an haunting question i can’t answer and i hope someone could do it for me: what’s the logic behind the reasoning of Jenner about the trans cause? It seems that she zigzags permanently in this subject. She in turn:
-a misaimed transactivist
-a boomrang bigot
-disinteresed of transactivism
-asking seemingly deliberately to leopards to eat her face
-whining when it happens but still loyal to the said leopards
-advocating for the said leopards going vegan
I don’t get the logic behind her reasoning since it’s not remotely consistent (outside her endorsement to the GOP), it’s worse than people who are stubborn about their opinions, who are at least coherent with themselves.
She cares about herself and only herself…
You also need to understand people have all types of motivation for transitioning.
Some people just feel more comfortable and want to live life that way, some are like Noem’s husband and it’s just a sex thing where they feel humiliation but want that.
But like everything else, it’s not a binary thing. She might want to transition full time and live life that way, but still (at least subconsciously) wants to be humialted and that’s why she’s republican.
It’s always super weird when any community wants to act like a monolith or that the solution is 3-4 categories instead of 2. The real answer is human variation is never binary, and everyone has their own motivations for everything they do.
Thinking of her as being transgender and trying to view everything thru that lens is just as dumb as any other gender discrimination, or really any other.
She’s a piece of shit who supports other pieces of shit, her being transgender doesn’t automatically mean she does (or needs to) support everyone else who transitioned. Like, I know people that transitioned, I don’t expect them to defend Jenner just because of that one shared experience. Because that’s still just one aspect of them as a person.
But people still expect Jenner to support everyone who transitioned for some reason. Even when they disagree on literally everything else. It’s distilling everything down to “us or them” and the reason this line of thinking is showing up on the left, is the American education system was gutted generations ago.
Look I agree with your main argument about people being varied and complicated. But there’s a couple things there that I think should be called out:
That’s not transitioning - he didn’t transition. A cross dressing or sissification or bimbofication fetish is one thing and we could debate about misogyny vs kinkshaming or whatever, but whatever way you slice it its different than transitioning.
Perhaps I’m too caught up on this, but the fact is that people often conflate transitioning with sexual motivations and fetishes inaccurately and in bad faith, and its not accurate
Similar to the above, I don’t think there’s any suggestion she ‘wants to be humiliated’ rather than acting in her self interest as a wealthy white woman. And yeah possibly there’s internalised transphobia as well or something? But that’s different than wanting to be humiliated, which to me implies some kind of sexual thing. Which again, needs to be entirely divorced from transitioning in the discourse
Right…
He is on one extreme.
And as I said, it’s not binary.
Some people, dress fulltime, but still have the same motivations as Noem’s husband.
It’s weird…
I wrote all that about how we should look at people individually, and you definitely read it, but still responded saying the “real solution” is making a shit ton of boxes to put them in along a single axis.
Completely and totally missing the larger point that there’s innumerable different axis.
The logical result of your idea, ends in mine where everyone is a unique person.
You’re just not thinking all the way thru.
Even two people on exactly the same spot on this axis, have so many different things, that getting them in the same “box” on this a is is pointless.
All boxes are pointless when talking about an individual.
You’re thinking of nouns and not adjectives, and that’s reductive even if coming from a good place.
Edit:
To clarify, Noem’s husband was an example of someone who (infrequently and in private) portrays themselves as a gender other than what they were assigned at birth.
It is a very long axis, and on the other end are people who get full surgery and live entire lives as a different gender.
Along the axis are occasional cross dressers, drag queens, people that just change underwear, and just literally too many different points to list.
Because if you keep looking closer, no two humans are ever exactly the same on any single axis.
Making two boxes is dumb.
Making 3 boxes is dumb, or 4 or 27, or however many different boxes, it will never be enough until every one has their own box, which is where we’d end up treating everyone as individuals on an individual level.
Conflating a cross-dressing kink and trans people is not talking about a variety of spectrums, it’s just innacurate
One is sexually motivated, the other isn’t. It’s a clear line.
I agree that people are too complex to be put into boxes, but we can talk about issues without overlapping them with completely separate ideas because of surface level similarities like wearing clothing designed for a different sex than your biological one.
The spectrum of people with humiliation or cross dressing kicks and trans people are two circles that might overlap like a Venn diagram, but they’re fundamentally different and acting like they aren’t is reducing trans people to sexually motivated fetishists. Its just not accurate
Again, to be perfectly clear: someone with a bimbofication kink is not on the same ‘axis’ as a trans person, and I find the suggestion that they are to be problematic at best and bigoted at worst
Edit:
This is it really. This is not an accurate or realistic portrayal of trans people. It’s a fun house mirror of trans identities pushed by bigots
I know there are boomrang bigots among the trans community, and they usually do not zigzags as much as her about their opinion and generally support transphobic things as long as it doesn’t affect them (or at least they think so). They have at least a bit of consistency, which i don’t see in the Jenner case.