Your car is collecting and selling your data—from driving habits to voice recordings—without your full consent. Learn how automakers, insurers, and even law e...
Modern cars are spy hubs on wheels, tracking your location, conversations, and behavior.
I’m not saying to capitulate, but building them yourself is not an option. First, they need to meet certain regulations. Most homemade vehicles can’t. Second, there’s already a federal law (maybe a bill) in the US that says some of these systems are required for new vehicles, IIRC. It does not make an exception for homemade vehicles. Maybe they can be disabled, but still technically in the vehicle?
Or americans can grow a spine and stand up to this overreaching bullshit. Stating there is a law and nothing can be done is american capitulation. You ether roll over or fight this sort of stuff, but if you roll over you don’t get to sit on a high horse.
People have been making stuff since stuff was made, or do you think everything ever was made from a company’s factory? This “nothing can be done” shit has gotten to such a degree of putting the boot on your own neck that you are saying its not possible for people to make a motor vehicle without backing.
If people did make there own cars (or more likely use old frames) and did not put spy tech into their own stuff what’s the government’s recourse? Enforcement at this degree is not possible, hell you americans hardly have a rule of law left.
The first paragraph is not really relevant to this thread. Yes, people should be fighting back. Sure. Things are happening regardless though.
People have been making stuff since stuff was made, or do you think everything ever was made from a company’s factory?
Making things to function at home is great! We should do more of that, and more FOSS. However, driving on a public road requires that you meet certain conditions. You can’t just throw a lawnmower engine on a set of wheels and call that enough. Yes, it’d drive, but it wouldn’t be legal. There are many types of vehicle that function that are not road legal. It is possible to meet those requirements with something built at home, but it requires serious technical knowledge, skill, and equipment. It also still has to conform to state and federal regulations.
Also, I agree with this, assuming it isn’t abused. I’m an Anarchist, but even I see the need to regulate vehicles people should be allowed to drive. We’re driving tons of steel at each other at high speed, just inches apart. You’re subjecting others to the danger you create. If your car breaks and swerves into incoming traffic at 60mph, that isn’t something the other party willingly consented to. It is the government’s role to protect people from harm. We go too far usually, but it needs to exist. I don’t want to be on the road where a bunch of homemade junk that hasn’t been regulated is driving around.
Regulating a car to spy and make actions based on that spying is not a valid regulation outside of a nightmare.
And no it is not the government’s role is to protect people from harm, this is “think of the children” sort of shit that leads to bad law. Ether we are responsible for our actions or are under control. I don’t want to share the road with these new vehicles but apparently have no say, this nonsense is why we all get to live in clown world.
The single greatest safety invention in automobiles by reduced death and injury was the collapsible steering column, everything since has had diminishing returns. In the last 10 years we have seen auto accidents increase (lots of pedestrian strikes) due to stupid new vehicle design. Yet we don’t see the demand that new stuff is pulled from the road, instead we see the demand for new rules putting more bad ideas in. This is and never had been about safety.
Not quite that much in most cases, but yes a good electric conversion is always in the 5 digits. My old Ranger would be $20K in today’s dollars to full convert, if done professionally and correctly. And there’s enough rust problems with a frame from the early 90s that you question if something like that is worth it in the long run.
Sure, but IIRC, there’s a federal law requiring certain devices to be included in a new car. That probably doesn’t include a rebuild, but it could if that becomes a popular enough option to avoid it. It’s also usually quite expensive.
Yeah and even if someone is just making barebones frames for kit builds, I think there are legal limits on the number of kit cars that a single shop can do in a year. But those are corporate protectionist laws that we should probably get rid of.
I looked at it at one point (quite a while back) and yes, it was more than a new car usually. It alone was about the price of a new car, like $30k IIRC (again, many years ago I think pre-covid even). You also need to include the car, so add a few thousand, or more depending on the car.
Yeah, it’s definitely something to look into. It’s not a bad deal at least. It just costs a lot because it’s mostly unique work for a single vehicle, rather than a factory pumping out the same one over and over.
That’s fair yeah… But I wouldn’t mind an EV, only an EV with all the data connection and all that bs, so this could be a good deal for me in the future
That’s not going to be a choice forever though. Even the best maintained cars eventually fail.
Then we build them ourselves. Capitulation is not inevitable.
I’m not saying to capitulate, but building them yourself is not an option. First, they need to meet certain regulations. Most homemade vehicles can’t. Second, there’s already a federal law (maybe a bill) in the US that says some of these systems are required for new vehicles, IIRC. It does not make an exception for homemade vehicles. Maybe they can be disabled, but still technically in the vehicle?
Or americans can grow a spine and stand up to this overreaching bullshit. Stating there is a law and nothing can be done is american capitulation. You ether roll over or fight this sort of stuff, but if you roll over you don’t get to sit on a high horse.
People have been making stuff since stuff was made, or do you think everything ever was made from a company’s factory? This “nothing can be done” shit has gotten to such a degree of putting the boot on your own neck that you are saying its not possible for people to make a motor vehicle without backing.
If people did make there own cars (or more likely use old frames) and did not put spy tech into their own stuff what’s the government’s recourse? Enforcement at this degree is not possible, hell you americans hardly have a rule of law left.
The first paragraph is not really relevant to this thread. Yes, people should be fighting back. Sure. Things are happening regardless though.
Making things to function at home is great! We should do more of that, and more FOSS. However, driving on a public road requires that you meet certain conditions. You can’t just throw a lawnmower engine on a set of wheels and call that enough. Yes, it’d drive, but it wouldn’t be legal. There are many types of vehicle that function that are not road legal. It is possible to meet those requirements with something built at home, but it requires serious technical knowledge, skill, and equipment. It also still has to conform to state and federal regulations.
Also, I agree with this, assuming it isn’t abused. I’m an Anarchist, but even I see the need to regulate vehicles people should be allowed to drive. We’re driving tons of steel at each other at high speed, just inches apart. You’re subjecting others to the danger you create. If your car breaks and swerves into incoming traffic at 60mph, that isn’t something the other party willingly consented to. It is the government’s role to protect people from harm. We go too far usually, but it needs to exist. I don’t want to be on the road where a bunch of homemade junk that hasn’t been regulated is driving around.
Regulating a car to spy and make actions based on that spying is not a valid regulation outside of a nightmare.
And no it is not the government’s role is to protect people from harm, this is “think of the children” sort of shit that leads to bad law. Ether we are responsible for our actions or are under control. I don’t want to share the road with these new vehicles but apparently have no say, this nonsense is why we all get to live in clown world.
The single greatest safety invention in automobiles by reduced death and injury was the collapsible steering column, everything since has had diminishing returns. In the last 10 years we have seen auto accidents increase (lots of pedestrian strikes) due to stupid new vehicle design. Yet we don’t see the demand that new stuff is pulled from the road, instead we see the demand for new rules putting more bad ideas in. This is and never had been about safety.
My 2010 Honda is trucking along but I wanted to upgrade to a hybrid… Fat chance of that happening.
Now I’ll ride this one until it dies.
Can’t you get older car rebuilt into electric? Seems like it could give it some more years. Correct me if I am wrong tho, I am not great at cars lol
For $50,000 …then you get an old car no one can fix.
Not quite that much in most cases, but yes a good electric conversion is always in the 5 digits. My old Ranger would be $20K in today’s dollars to full convert, if done professionally and correctly. And there’s enough rust problems with a frame from the early 90s that you question if something like that is worth it in the long run.
Sure, but IIRC, there’s a federal law requiring certain devices to be included in a new car. That probably doesn’t include a rebuild, but it could if that becomes a popular enough option to avoid it. It’s also usually quite expensive.
Yeah and even if someone is just making barebones frames for kit builds, I think there are legal limits on the number of kit cars that a single shop can do in a year. But those are corporate protectionist laws that we should probably get rid of.
Would hope for EU to not have these laws, but I feel like that would be too much hope
The EU seems to being going full steam on destroying privacy too, so I wouldn’t bet on it.
Unfortunately yeah… I believe they are talking about reviving Chat Control 1.0 today… Once again
The institution can propose the unpopular policy more times than a population unable or unwilling to alter the institution can smack it down.
True, so far we’ve been fighting this peacefully, and they keep coming back… Maybe we need to push harder against
A lot of states dont have inspections anymore. How would they know if I converted an old car to an EV?
Some companies do offer this for a quite hefty price.
Heftier than a new car?
I looked at it at one point (quite a while back) and yes, it was more than a new car usually. It alone was about the price of a new car, like $30k IIRC (again, many years ago I think pre-covid even). You also need to include the car, so add a few thousand, or more depending on the car.
Closer to $50K. It’s a lot of specialized labor and those shops charge $200/hr.
Considering there aren’t any new cars I want and the average price of one is about that much it sounds good to me.
If I already have a car I like that sounds like an awesome deal.
Yeah, it’s definitely something to look into. It’s not a bad deal at least. It just costs a lot because it’s mostly unique work for a single vehicle, rather than a factory pumping out the same one over and over.
That’s fair yeah… But I wouldn’t mind an EV, only an EV with all the data connection and all that bs, so this could be a good deal for me in the future
You will spend $50K on a car that is subsequently worthless.
Every car you buy is subsequently worthless.
So will I. I hope to time it just right.
Then I’ll get a horse.
horses are expensive to upkeep too, even more so than cars.
That’s a whole new ethical dilemma, ride a bike!
Will a bike walk me home after a night of drinking? I think not.
Drunk Japanese businessmen have been known to steal unlocked mamacharis to get home, returning them the next day with an apology note.
@Semi_Hemi_Demigod @Cethin
check whats inside when you buy ;-)