Not at all comparable. And as has been pointed out elsewhere in this thread, testing rival airspaces with fighter planes has been a common even banal tactic used by a number of country’s airforces, certainly including the US who has employed it countless times.

Even if a person were to concede, as you are insisting, that the US does not = NATO (though for all intents and purposes that is effectively true, let’s set that aside for now), then that doesn’t change the fact that when you said:

The only country NATO invaded was also invaded by Russia.

You were demonstrating a complete and shameful lack of historical knowledge. That statement is just a ridiculous, ahistorical lie. Formally, undeniably, admittedly even by NATO, these following countries have been invaded by NATO: Yugoslavia, Afghanistan (the only one you seem to be aware of), and Libya. And NATO as an organization admits to “indirect participation” in the invasion of Iraq.

So set aside your other petty derailment arguments about NATO not technically being the US and acknowledge that you were full of shit even before Iran, Korea, Vietnam, and Cuba were brought up.

Edit: Ok, I guess you can’t acknowledge it, I see now that you were banned. Well I wasn’t holding my breath you were going to anyway. lol

Isn’t that all rUzZiAn DiSiNfOrMaTzIa though?

omg… That must mean ChatGPT is a Russian agent bot!

wtf, I love ChatGPT now?

This post is the one I was referring to when I used the word mandate, a post made by someone I believe was an admin at the time, but maybe not. But I also talked to someone at the time from there who was a frequent commenter in places like the lemmy c/worldnews comm and they were very angry about having their posts and comments removed, while others were banned. I checked the modlog and sure enough. I’m really not trying to stir shit, it’s just something I’m sincerely curious about because it seemed so… off brand to me, to use a lib phrase.

Honest question, I thought hexbear had a mandate against “lionizing Luigi Mangione,” but I have been seeing more hexbear users like u/QuietCupcake even in this thread posting emojis that I thought would have gotten them removed or worse last December. Is that why OP is posting it here with an .ml account even though (forgive and correct me if I’m wrong comrade) you’re mostly a hexbear user? Did the mods there ever acknowledge the absurdity of that rule and roll it back, was it just quietly forgotten, or is it still selectively enforced? Don’t get me wrong, I think hexbear is mostly a great instance that I often comment in solidarity with, but I was surprised to see what seemed like an extremely uncharacteristic liberal position they took on that.

Putin’s political opponents frequently fall out of windows or catch some polonium poisoning.

Hmm… I wonder what happened to the original leadership of BLM? And hey, what are Fred Hampton and Mark Clark up to these days? Has Gary Webb published any articles recently?

These things are not the same, and pretending they are, makes you blind to how much worse they can still get. Russia is absolutely more of a brutal dictatorship than even the US, but especially than most European countries.

Oh believe me, I am well aware how bad they can get, you’re just completely unaware of how bad they’ve already been. You believe all these lies about how terrible Russia is, looking at it only through the lens that western propagandists have carefully cultivated for you without realizing that every accusation they’ve levied on their enemies is a confession about what they themselves have been doing all along. You’re as intellectually domesticated by US imperialist interests as any diehard Kremlin-supporting Russian citizen, only you have the benefit of being on the side that enjoys global hegemony without even understanding what that word means. You’re all up in arms about the lies of the media of an enemy state without having even an ounce of self awareness about the lies of the media you’re consuming, the very same media from which you think you’ve learned how uniquely bad the enemy’s media is.

SocDem is not right-wing by even the farthest stretch of the imagination

“Social Democracy objectively represents the moderate wing of Fascism.” - J. V. Stalin

https://marxistleninist.wordpress.com/2010/04/13/bourgeois-democracy-and-fascism/

Even after the victory of fascism, the influence, ideology and traditions of Social Democracy continue their baleful and disorganising role, preventing the emergence of a united working class front to confront and defeat fascism. Further, if fascist dictatorship’s grip on power weakens, then Social Democracy stands in wait to come to the rescue of capitalism.

What is beyond doubt is that both Social Democracy and fascism are agents of monopoly capitalism; both fight tooth and nail against the struggle of the working class for its social emancipation. With this as their aim, both disrupt and weaken working-class organisations.

Their methods are, however, different. While fascism smashes the class organisations of the working class from without and opposes their whole basis and counters them with an alternative ‘national’ ideology, Social Democracy undermines them from within by diverting them along reformist bourgeois channels. Whereas fascism relies mainly on coercion, along with deception, Social Democracy relies mainly on deception, along with coercion. Their aims are identical; only their methods differ. In view of the identity of their aims and differing methods, one cannot but agree with Stalin’s observation, made as early as 1924, that “Social Democracy objectively represents the moderate wing of Fascism.” (Concerning the International Situation, Collected Works, vol 6, p.294)

Russia is no more a “brutal dictatorship” than the US is, or the UK, or any number of other capitalist shithole countries that call themselves “democracies.” Russian state media is no worse than, for example, the BBC or CNN. But more importantly, it does not have the global reach that the BBC and CNN have. The key thing that you’re utterly failing to understand here is that Russia does not have the global hegemony that the US has (and NATO in general, though NATO is just a collection of vassal states subservient to US capital). Russian state media cannot begin to compete on the global stage with the overwhelming stranglehold that western media has over not only their own domestic populations but the rest of the world. We here in the west are not saturated day in and day out by Russian propaganda, but we absolutely are by western capital (which is synonymous with US state) propaganda. Pretending like this is an even playing field is absurd and it’s why no one here is taking your whining about eBiL RuZzIaN media seriously. It’s not about “defending” Russian media, it’s about recognizing geopolitical reality.

The “Every Accusation a Confession” rule of thumb strikes again.

Thank you for staying on top of this kind of shit and exposing them when necessary.

Appreciate the informative list of links! (Very common u/davel W).

Also lol at my comment being reported to mods as propaganda for stating a simple, verifiable fact. Always funny how the dronies think it’s “propaganda” just for going against what they want to believe even when their beloved western sources reported on it back before it became no-no to do so. (A NATO No-No, if you will). I’d ask what instance the [redacted] reporter was from, but I guess that might give away exactly who it was.

The Eastern provinces that the neonazi-led Ukrainian government was ethnically cleansing, and who had been asking for Russia’s help (and to join Russia) since long before February of of 2022? Yes. Yes, they should be Russia.

The “tankie” instances are the least likely to have bots. They’re the most vehemently anti-AI and the moderators most active in banning any kind of bot-like activity. Hexbear, the one that all the dronies clutch their pearls about most and accuse of brigading the most doesn’t even have downvotes - they are incapable of mass downvoting.

Diseases did not conquer hundreds of tribes.

Disease played a major role in the European’s ability to conquer those tribes. It’s not an either/or situation. It is true that the “Americas” that the English started colonizing had already been devastated by the contagions brought by the Spanish. The English undoubtedly would have found it far more difficult and maybe even impossible to conquer those hundreds of tribes had they not first been so severely depopulated by pandemic. Acknowledging this does not absolve or even lessen the atrocities committed by the English.

You’re a reactionary cosplaying as a leftist

Every accusation a confession.

I am fully convinced that a small number of users on this instance are here with the intention of making anarchists look bad, the intention to really drive in the nail (one crafted by the enemies of all of the left) that anarchism is the ideology of spoiled, tantrum-throwing children. Because that’s how @masquenox@lemmy.dbzer0.com and a few others like them are behaving. Actual anarchism is not this, of course, but that’s why I am so convinced that either these puerile users don’t know what real anarchism is, or they do but are only pretending to be anarchists online to “troll” real leftists, be their targets Marxist-Leninist or real anarchists or any other genuine leftist tendency.

Anyone reading these exchanges (even lurking liberals) who have any experience interacting with their fellow humans, can immediately spot who in these threads are speaking in good faith, are interested in learning and understanding the world, interested in presenting valid evidence and reasoning for their beliefs (people like @CascadeOfLight@hexbear.net in this particular subthread), versus which other participants in this thread are acting completely, openly, and smugly in bad faith with no interest in either the truth or in learning, let alone any interest in having a real discussion, because they make it clear the only interest they have is “owning” opponents, or since they can’t manage that, just being inflammatory and saying things we all know are absurd but are designed to cause upset even when it lays bare their own pathetic ignorance. Trolling, in other words. It is so blatantly obvious who is just here spewing whatever they can with the intent to make people angry. It doesn’t have to be reflective of reality, they don’t have to even make sense, they just say things in a transparent attempt to shit-fling.

I say let them keep at it, they will wear themselves out eventually, as conniption-having toddlers always do. But also because it is so obvious what they’re doing, anyone watching from the sidelines, especially anyone “without a horse in this race” can see that the “tankies” and actual anarchists (like @Nakoichi@hexbear.net), at least in this thread, are the ones who know what they’re talking about and have genuine convictions and a dedication to justice. I want to reiterate that (real) anarchists have these positive qualities too, but a select few of the cringe users in this thread like masquenox who claim to be anarchists should not be taken as being even remotely representative of what people who belong to that tendency are like or what they believe. The anarchists I know irl and consider friends and comrades wouldn’t be caught dead associating with these tantrum-throwing, “tankie-hating” children.

I don’t appreciate the genocide of me and my communities being denied

I don’t appreciate the struggle of me and my communities (trans and disabled, just like you claim to be!) being used as a wedge in a despicable attempt to steer the conversation away from Wynn’s genocide denial. It’s hilarious that you’re accusing us of genocide denial because we’re telling you… not to defend genocide denial. That’s some sick and twisted logic.
Then why are you trying to deny or trivialize the genocide of Palestinians? A genocide that itself includes the slaughter of trans people and disabled people? I notice you didn’t respond to what @Belly_Beanis@hexbear.net said because it completely undermined your attempt to use trans and disabled people to deflect and defend a genocide denier.

because it’s not the same as the graphic vids you watch

I don’t watch “graphic vids” but I do inform myself of what’s actually happening in the world rather than deny the reality or pretend my own plight is the only one that should matter, like you are doing. Also shame on you for your transparent attempt to make it sound like having knowledge of the brutal carnage that Palestinians are subjected to is just a lurid desire for shock value.

Do better and read about genocide if that’s something you’re genuinely interested in.

Do better and read more about western chauvinism, intersectionality, and even trans liberation outside the imperial core and your highly privileged position there. Relieve yourself of your petty chauvinist ignorance. I can already tell I’ve read more about genocide than the sum of your entire reading of leftist theory. My god, talk about larpers.

The genocide we face is silent,

Oh fuck OFF. You are talking to largely trans and majority queer people here and telling them to stop talking about the genocide of Palestinians, to stop criticizing a fascist-flirting liberal who is saying the genocide is really nbd guys! You’re telling a trans community they’re “scapegoating” someone who is using her platform to push fascist, Zionist talking points. Grotesque hypocrite. You: “The genocide we face is silent, so stop talking about genocide denial and stay silent.”

I’m not comparing it to kids being physically maimed by bombs and saying “but we have it bad too”,

That’s exactly what you did and are doing. In fact you did worse, you tried to tell us we shouldn’t even be talking about Wynn’s hand-waving away of children murdered by the tens of thousands because “I have it bad too!”

I’m saying that it literally meets the criteria in many similar ways.

What you and I both experience as trans and disabled people in the west is not anywhere near the magnitude of what the people of Gaza are experiencing, including the trans and disabled people being murdered there as a part of that genocide, which Wynn, and now you, are trivializing and trying to shift the conversation away from.

I’ve watched the far left neglect caring for their own communities while LARPING at protests for almost two decades now.

What does that have to do with criticizing a genocide denier? The fact that there hasn’t been a far left movement in the west for decades has nothing to do with the fact that we need to call out genocide denial and ridicule the people who use their platform to do it. Oh, I see… you’re trying to say that people who protest US imperialism and the mass murder it commits all over the world are just larpers who are “neglecting their own communities.” Bull fucking shit. The people most active in opposing imperialism are invariably also the ones most likely to be there doing the real work to help the oppressed and marginalized around them. Once again, you’re trying to weasel in this idea that it’s not possible to do both, that they are even in conflict, when the truth is the exact fucking opposite: these two things, opposition to genocide abroad and resistance to oppression at home, can’t be separated and working towards one will always be a benefit to other as well. If one is a principled leftist (which you very clearly are not) they oppose oppression in all forms, and they certainly don’t do what you’re doing by trying to separate and silence. This tactic of trying to divide intersectional issues, exactly what you’re trying and failing to do here, is a well known tactic the rightwing deliberately uses to undermine the left. And I have a strong suspicion that is what is actually happening here as well.

It’s death by a thousand cuts and the worst are from people who are performative radicals.

Yes. And anyone with eyes can see that the performative radical here is you.

Your comment is pretty shitty tbh, you remind me of myself when I existed in a bubble of radical leftism online around 2010.

I’ve been an activist since the 90s. And everything you’ve said is very revealing that you don’t know shit about what you’re talking about, kid. As for how “shitty” my comment was, I’ll let the upvote ratio speak for itself here, lol. I’m glad to see that your bullshit is apparent to everyone reading.

She probably got money from the DNC, too, when she went to meet Hillary Clinton.

How is she still making money tho?

All you need to live a comfy, bougie lifestyle after that are “investments.”

You are absolutely right and I should have said that too. Thank you for pointing it out.

As a disabled trans person I find this comparison rather disgusting:

There is also an ongoing trans genocide no one talks about enough, it’s easier to ignore, and genocide of disabled people, both happening within our local communities.

The systemic oppression we face is real, horrible, and is an incalculable injustice that needs to be fought at all costs. But it is categorically not the same as the wholesale literal slaughter of tens of thousands of Palestinian children. Don’t tell me you can look at the images coming out of Gaza of countless mangled bodies in the bombed-out rubble of their homes and hospitals and say “yeah, but I’m being genocided like that too.” This is a category error and I find it more than “kind of gross.”

What’s more is that it doesn’t matter which injustice is “worse.” Giving one attention does not mean we should be silent on the other. That’s not how the fight against injustice works. It’s competition-brained bullshit at best. Everyone here agrees with the fact that transphobia is a deep social evil that we all have to struggle against, but using it as leverage to say we should talk less about the downplaying and denial of the genocide in Gaza, that is reprehensible. Both of these injustices can be (and often are) talked about and struggled against simultaneously without detracting from the other. By calling out Wynn’s scummy liberal, bordering on genocide-denying rhetoric, and expressing our disgust with a person who would use their large platform to spew that rhetoric, we are not in any way detracting from the fight against transphobia or ableism. On the other hand, when someone comes along and says we shouldn’t be loudly calling out that kind of behavior, that really is a kind of detraction from that struggle.

I don’t agree with her politics and viscerally feel the innate violence of liberalism but also listen to her streams when I need to know I’m not alone in being trans, depressed and an addict.

If you have a parasocial attachment to a problematic personality and find them somehow comforting, fine. I’m sure many here can relate simply because we live in a world dominated by liberalism. But don’t tell others they shouldn’t be vocally critical of those things you yourself say you recognize are bad. Personally, I wouldn’t want to keep listening to someone who uses aspects I share (trans, depressed, addiction) as they’re pushing a liberal agenda, what you yourself described as the innate violence of liberalism. It’s not a crime to have low standards, but to defend the indefensible or tell others to be quiet about it, that’s going beyond just having a problematic fav.

Are there better people to tear down at the moment.

Don’t do that. Don’t do the “worse things exist so don’t talk about this one bad thing that I say is lesser.” Whether or not you realize you’re doing it, that is an actual known tactic to throw a wrench in organizing efforts and derail leftist groups. It comes back to that same false binary I was talking about above. Yes there are and always will be “better people to tear down” that is, “worse people” like those in power who are the ones actively waging the genocide. But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be rightly criticizing other ghouls and vultures engaging in genocide denialist rhetoric which is what Wynn is doing.

Reading the hate towards her feels kind of gross, like a real easy scapegoat for anger n frustration at liberals

She is not a scapegoat. She is a millionaire with a substantial following and platform she is using to push fascist-adjacent talking points. This shit needs to be loudly criticized and called what it is. If she doesn’t want that criticism, she can just not say that shit. She is not a leftist, she is a liberal Clintonesque centrist. She deserves every bit of ire she gets from the left, the same as any right wing pundit.

Not from what I’ve seen at all. The people who insist on calling Palestinians (and any Arab people who oppose Zionism) “terrorists” are often the same people frothing at the mouth about how we have to smash the Russian “orcs.” Granted, this isn’t limited only to Germans, but I’ve definitely seen it specifically from them as well.