I think it was the prime minister (or spokesperson) who made this very clever argument: (paraphrasing) “we are not taking away choice… cigarettes are designed to inherently take away your choice by trapping you in an addiction.”
I’m not picking sides here, just pointing out a great piece of rhetoric to spin the policy as taking away something that takes away your choice. Effectively putting forward the idea that you don’t have choice to begin with.
(sorry to say this rhetoric was not mentioned in the linked article; I just heard it on BBC World Service)
I’ll happily pick a side as a kid who grew up in a house constantly full of smoke and a parent who’s a total mess at least partially because of this. Good. It’s about time some serious steps were taken. Not to mention the effects of second hand smoke.
You’re parent(s) not having the sense to go outside and stay away from you while smoking shouldn’t impact my ability to smoke alone.
And it won’t, unless you were born after 2009.
deleted by creator
I’m of two minds of this. While I know that prohibition laws haven’t succeeded in the past, I also know that nowadays people don’t complain that coca cola doesn’t have cocaine anymore. It’s a harmful substance that was legislated out of being so easily accessible.
Also, with the trend towards fewer younger people smoking altogether it seems as though introducing it in this way to make it so that young people might not see it as an option makes sense to me, although maybe it’s optimistic of me to think so. The idea that smoking is already seen as an “old person” activity and efforts taken to minimize its attractiveness to youth, now following that with legislation, seems to make a logical sort of progress.
That said, I understand the black market is always going to be a thing. OP put it really well though- when something is designed to be addictive you’re already having your choices removed by being pushed to use it. If the availability is minimized, then hopefully the number of those who depend on it will also be minimized. I’m glad it’s being trialled somewhere, and am interested to see how it goes- though also hope if there are negative repercussions these legislative changes can be changed or rolled back depending on what those consequences look like and/or merit.
deleted by creator
I think it would be nigh-impossible to make tobbaco non-carcinogenic though. And even without cancers, there’s also a myriad of respiratory issues, cardiovascular problems and even autoimmune problems stemming from cigarette use to account for. I don’t think it would be feasible to ban the harmful ingredients and have anything left over.
^this guy over here trying to sell organic cigarettes
XD
Didn’t New Zealand try this and eventually walk it back?
I’m ideologically opposed to anything that prevents an adult from doing what they want to their own body. That said, we need to do a better job keeping children off of those substances (and all the other ones that aren’t legal for adults, but should be)
( Exception for things like antibiotics, which endanger everyone else if you abuse them. Other drugs should be regulated like alcohol : no sale to minors, restrictions on activities like driving when under the influence. Maybe the age should also be 21 or 25 instead of 18 )
On the other hand, a complete ban on smoking in public spaces could be helpful ? I’m not certain if it has been tried 🤷🏻♀️
South Africa was trying this when I moved away about 15 years ago. If you wanted to smoke you had to sit in separate closed off area in restaurants (for example).
No idea what the ultimate outcome of that was though.Edit: According to smokefreeworld.org:
The adult smoking rate declined from 27.1 percent in 2000 to 18.2 percent in 2012
That was my thought too. Ban it in public spaces so the rest of us don’t have to breath that toxic shit, but if people want to spend money to kill themselves at home then let them. But don’t cover their related health expenses.
I disagree about the health stuff, but I’m French, so I’ve always taken is as a given that we pay (almost) every healthcare expense through taxes. If you ask me, that’s just the cost of freedom 🤷🏻♀️
I agree healthcare should be a shared expense except in cases where a person knowingly does this much damage to their body. Not a hill I’d die on, but it seems more fair.
Don’t cover anyone who drinks beer, eats fast food, etc etc then.
Surely that will be good for society.
If someone is alcoholic or eats until their health is seriously compromised they could cover related medical expenses with private insurance.
No need to downvote and get sarcastic just because you disagree.
deleted by creator
I don’t live in the UK but I would not support this anywhere because making something banned makes people want to use it and creates a black market. I would absolutely support raising the minimum age you are allowed to consume it at. But not a complete ban.
What if we raise the minimum age by 1 year, each year
The intention is meritable. As usual, Tories misunderstand how to achieve the stated objective. They’ll be creating a secondary market whereby those born before 2009 will supply cigarettes to those born after 2009… for a fee of course. Party of business and entrepreneurialship.
Also, drinking yourself into a stupor seems to be socially acceptable in the UK whilst the cost is much larger.
Cigarettes were already heavily taxed in the UK anyway. The relative share of smokers is much lower compared to places like France.
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/smoking-rates-by-country
If the goal is to improve everyone’s well-being, is this the best way to achieve it?
Until no one is left alive who can buy cigarettes. Or rather, until no one produces cigarettes on an industrial level because the narket is so small. Then they need to grow tobacco themselves and suffer without buckets of toxic shit put into commercial cigarettes.
I’m all for making drastic positive changes in our lifetimes, but a slow change is better than no change
