I love this, you made me smile on a very shit day, so thank you for that.
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When did voting become mandatory?
The only obligation to voting is your right to exercise it how you choose, full stop. It is not anyone's "job" to vote any specific way, this is the entitlement Democratic voters need to get over.
Yeah, Trump won because he convinced his base he was worth voting for. Harris couldn't convince her base that he was a threat and that she was worth voting for.
She did try to win over Republican voters instead of her own, though. 94% of them voted Republican anyway, just like they did in 2020.
But I'm sure you'll tell me that was the voter's fault too. 🙄
Edit: I brought up mandatory voting because it could be legislated that way, just as voting day could be made a federal holiday. And laws could be passed to mandate paid time off to allow essential workers to vote on voting day if absentee/early voting are unavailable. Or what if you were automatically registered to vote on your 18th birthday, none of this registering nonsense.
Damn, those are all great policy ideas that the Democrats could run on, or even implement, since they have been outwardly more supportive of people voting. Funny that they haven't done that in the last couple decades...
... It's almost like the Dems don't want that roughly 60% of people who don't vote to start voting. Wonder why that is...
Those that didn't vote failed to stop fascism from rising.
The Democratic party, who failed to rally non-voters and instead chose to try and court Republican voters to their cause, failed to stop fascism from rising.
Stop blaming voters for politicians running on unpopular policies. I've checked repeatedly today, Harris lost Michigan by under 100,000 votes, but there were over 100,000 protest votes during the primary.
Before the election, 35% of Pennsylvania voters and 37% of Arizona voters polled said they would be more likely to vote for Harris if they would agree to cease weapons shipments to Israel without contingencies. The DNC sent Bill Clinton to lecture the residents of Michigan about why Israel is justified in killing their loved ones instead of, idk, taking a stance that could win you much needed votes in a swing state. They brought Republican after Republican to speak at the DNC, but allotted no time for Palestinian Democrats to speak.
They gave their own constituents the middle finger, like always, while demanding their unwavering support. All while being more concerned about trying to win over Republicans instead of rallying their own non-voters to the polls.
Gee, that sure worked out great for them, is that the voter's fault too? It's astounding how the same people who were insulting and condescending to conflicted Dem voters the last couple weeks are now screeching and crying that it's the fault of the people they insulted and bullied that they lost.
Y'all don't have mirrors you can look in? Maybe start there, and understand why you can't dismiss the concerns of entire swaths of your constituency and still feel entitled to their support, regardless of the dire threat that the Democrats didn't take seriously enough.
"I didn't hear anyone calling for other candidates."
That was a response I got from a guy when I brought up the botched primary all thanks to Biden's hubris.
Like, no shit Sherlock, we couldn't call for anyone else, there was no time!
What are you talking about?!?! The Dems ran a flawless campaign, it's all the voters who are wrong!!! Don't know they know what the Dems tell them is right is right?!? Don't you know you're fucking stupid if you have any qualms about not voting for Harris?!?
- 90% of Lemmy users right now trying to find any reason to blame anyone but the DNC for their hubris and entitlement
What's a politicians job during the campaign?
To convince people that they're worth electing.
No one fell for anything, the Democrats are a shitty party who won't get with the times, no one was brainwashed, you just sound sad and delusional.
Is it true or not that Biden has continued support to Israel, unmitigated and even sidestepping Congress, despite vocal outcries from his constituents? Is it true or not that Harris basically followed Biden's policy regarding Palestine despite vocal opposition from within her own party?
A lot of younger people didn't know better and fell for it.
THERE IT IS!! Can't just blame all voters, no no, now we've got to blame young voters specifically for the Democrats failing to distance themselves from a genocide, and running an uninspiring campaign for a large part of their voting populace they completely discounted.
God, I didn't think it'd be a post-election day discussion without the young people being blamed for everything.
Israel's genocide in Gaza has been Gen Z's moral injury.
Israel's genocide in Gaza was the softest ball the Democrats could've been served, and they whiffed on it repeatedly. A proxy state humiliated us and made us their bitch on the world stage, and the Democrats still wouldn't stop cradling Netanyahu's balls for him.
And it's disgusting that politicians put the American people in the situation of having to choose whether or not to support a genocide, and worse, to what degree they support one.
Bad actors exploited that to give fascists the win. And a lot of people fell for it.
I didn't realize bad actors pointed out the absurdity of the Democrat campaign (not allowing primaries because Biden wouldn't step down and his staff hid his failing mental faculties, running on a centrist platform despite early progressive motivation, reversing her fracking policy, not supporting M4A, basically being Biden 2.0).
I also didn't realize bad actors chose to try and court the vote of people who would never support them (Republicans) while making no effort to win over the more progressive part of the party because 🤷♀️. That's the real "fell for it": the Democrats really thought "wE'rE nOt FaScIsT" was going to be good enough for another election. They really thought getting Walz to play on Twitch was more important and enticing then telling Americans they would get progressive policies.
But you're right, let's keep blaming the voters fed up with the system, and especially being fed up with, "No no, for realz, this time for realz we promise we'll do the things we promised the last 4 times, really for real."
Maybe the Democrats should've taken their voters seriously, and their wants seriously, at any point in the last few decades. But no, we get centrist, status quo bullshit, and if we demand our candidates move left, we get chucklefucks like you telling us we need to meet them in the very middle, and then we can start asking them to move our way. Bullshit, the Democrats can move left, or they can cease to exist, we keep trying it their way, and nothing is getting done.
Hope it was worth losing to fascism, DNC, you and your party elite sure do keep showing us you know best. 👍
Once again, I fucking understand what you're saying, quoting it for the third time doesn't make it sound anymore correct. What part of "To go to the middle, you have to compromise from the left, and therefore are already giving up on progress" do you not seem to understand?!
We're on the same side, I'm telling you the average American doesn't give a flying fuck. "We need to play the political blah blah" we've been listening to it for fucking decades, shit or get off the pot. The Democrats don't want to pass progressive policy, they don't want progressive voices at the forefront of their party, and "meeting them in the middle and becoming centrists to then infiltrate them" is so fucking ass backwards I'm tired of you parroting it at me like it's some groundbreaking idea.
The DNC chooses their candidates that they back and run, they choose to run centrists across the country, all they have to do is shift the party platform and run more progressive candidates. They've had the ability to do so for decades, and they just fucking won't.
So I don't understand why you think working with them, compromising with them when they do nothing but give empty promises and bullshit excuses, is somehow going to magically turn the party left because of one cult-like candidate (who we had, btw, Bernie, the DNC shit all over him, remember) who "centralizes power."
We both want the party to move left, I think you're way of doing so is ass backwards, and you, mine. So I'm done with this discussion.
This was beautifully put. 💜
I'm flattered you think my writing is good enough for a copypasta 🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰
I like how I'm providing context and thought, y'know, those things in your brain that make your head hurt, but I'm also the copypasta troll who can't handle being told they're wrong.
That's cute, you're cute
No, I didn't miss it, you just will never convince me that progress can only be made by riding in the middle. Harris needed to be a shift left that a lot of people in this country are desperate for, and instead, she chose centrist policies and pandering to Republicans for their votes.
The "political" game is over, we needed actual change, and we got it, just not from the candidate we needed.
Shocker.
You were had.
It's people like you that just prove my point.
I voted for Harris. I wasn't "had."
We needed to delay fascism four more years to get a progressive or socialist candidate in the next Democratic primary.
Yeah, I'm fucking tired of hearing this. Y'know what could've delayed fascism and turned out the vote? Any measurable progress for the average American over the last four years.
You're so oblivious to it, and you act like you're the only one who actually gets it. You think Biden's mental acuity dropped overnight in July?
The DNC was well aware of his declining mental health well before that, well before the primaries. And they hid it, and actively chose to hide it from the country, all while acting like all was completely fine. Then they waited for the debate, saw it went disastrously, and then decided it'd be best to run another candidate. Except, le gasp, there is not enough time to run a full primary! Oh no! What do we do?!
Eh, we'll just run the VP, and we'll run her on a centrist platform to try and win over Republicans. Yeah, yeah... That'll do it.
Where was Bernie in that discussion? Or better yet, how did it go trying to get Bernie as the candidate in 2016? I distinctly remember the DNC acting completely above board the entire time, listening to their constituents, and running a progressive campaign tha-
Oh, wait, no, that's all a lie. Historically, factually, it was a lie. The DNC has made it clear they will not, ever, support a progressive candidate. They showed us that in 2016, they showed us in 2020, and even when faced with fucking fascism, they refused to run a progressive platform in 2024.
This time, please join them instead of arguing against them. Saying 'both sides' isn't helping.
Oh go fuck yourself. Playing the "Just four more years of centrism, we promise for realz this time, 100%" is not helping.
Speaking to people on here like they're some misguided child who spilled a glass of milk is "not helping."
Trying to distance the Democrats from the conservative party they are and continue to show themselves to be "isn't helping."
Fuck you.
It’s not much different than all of you saying
Wow... So the constituents of a political party wanting their concerns and issues addressed and taken seriously, otherwise they just won't vote for a party that doesn't represent them...
Is the same thing as the political party, who is supposed to represent the interests of their constituents, telling their constituents to tow the line or they'll become more fascist.
Constituents: We want our concerns addressed and progress made for the working people.
Democrats: Support us unconditionally or we'll just become more like the fascists to win their support, since our actions show winning is all that matters.
You: These are literally the same argument, but the constituents are the wronger ones.
All because of a single issue in a country we didn’t know existed a year ago!”
This right here is what I've been pointing out for the last week: Democrats lose because the party is condescending, dismissive, and insulting to anyone who dares voice criticism. So those 100,000 protest votes organized by Muslim and Arab Americans, the same amount that Harris is currently losing Michigan by, yeah, that's just a single issue voter who hasn't even heard of Palestine until a year ago.
How incredibly insulting to people you're supposedly trying to win over while completely dismissing their concerns. Would you like to join the Palestinian speakers at the DNC on stage so you can insult them to their faces? Just kidding, the DNC chose to parade a bunch of Republicans across the stage rather than let a Palestinian speak.
We don’t really give a shit
The DNC to every progressive voter every voting day.
about the hardships they’ll now face because you didn’t cave in and do shit we don’t even understand!”
What shit were Democrat voters asking for that they didn't understand? Seriously, I want you to explain that to me, because from my understanding:
- They wanted positive climate initiatives, and two weeks into the campaign Harris went pro-fracking despite initially being anti-fracking.
- They want the Palestinian genocide to stop, Biden has put no contingencies on weapons transfers to Israel, Harris signalled she only wanted to stop the war. Again, the DNC completely ignored the Arab/Muslim voices protesting this entire election
- They want progress that is actually meaningful and impactful, not these half-assed decades-late measures like the $15/hr minimum wage (should he $26/hr now with inflation), or only expanding Medicare for specific services rather than Medicare4All
- They want an economy that actually reflects their struggles instead of being fed the same metrics that only effect millionaires
- They wanted a candidate they could see positive change in, and Harris returned to the typical Status-Quo Democrat playbook that keeps costing them elections
Those don't seem like things Americans don't understand, maybe you and the Democratic leadership need to get off your high horses and maybe acknowledge that people want to see actionable change and not just election cycle after election cycle of excuses and empty promises.
And just a reminder, Democrats had decades to enshrine Roe into law, and didn't do so the few opportunities they had because it was more useful as a campaign device.
If they just flagrantly broke the law and kept doing it until the SCOTUS and others actually stopped them, the dems would be far more popular than just throwing their hands up and saying "better things aren't possible.
This is basically what FDR did with a lot of his social and work programs during his presidency. He'd establish an agency or authority or whatever, regardless of the legality, and by the time the court's or whoever made the decision to close it, they'd have 5 others going simultaneously, and/or they'd make another one. And the process would start all over again.
First of all, do not tell me that I've been "duped" or don't understand the situation, because I could say the exact same of you thinking the parties are not the same. And to be clear, I did not claim they're both the same side, in fact, if you go back and look at a lot of my comments from the last week (excluding today), I actually explicitly point out that I encourage everyone to vote for Harris.
But she is not a progressive candidate, and she never ran as a progressice candidate. Everyone here is always screaming about "When someone shows you who they are, believe them" about Trump and his ilk, but none of you will apply the same scrutiny to the Democrats and their party leadership.
As the campaign went on, Harris moved further to the right, and that is evident by her adopting some of Biden's policies (Biden, btw, is still detaining immigrants at the border and doing all of the things we criticize the Republicans for, in fact, his administration actually helped pass a more strict immigration policy for the border). She garnered as much former Republican support as she could (no Palestinians were allowed to speak at the DNC, but they had how many Republicans parade across the stage).
I am begging you. You have been fooled. Please believe me. Again, it is not possible for me to argue you out of this. You have to trust someone. If you can't trust me or any of the other people on lemmy saying the same thing, find someone irl you can trust. That's the only way you can get better.
This is the kind of shit I would expect to hear from a cult, not someone trying to have a rational discussion about the failings of a political party. She showed us she cared more about garnering the votes of Republicans than she did trying to win over progressive non-voters within her own party. Biden has shown us he's made progress, but not to the average American, and not in any meaningful way.
And y'all need to stop acting like Harris got on stage and by virtue of not being Trump was going to save this country. She's a career centrist Democrat who ran on a centrist platform, promising a centrist return to the status quo that centrist Joe Biden has been leading us through for four years.
Y'all keep trying to get your party on board with incremental change while they witness landfall change coming from the other party. Maybe the Democrats need to adopt more progressive policies and run candidates voters want to vote for for fucking once, instead of counting in someone to vote against.
Or they can keep screaming that our voices, concerns, and wants don't matter, and they can keep trying to pander votes from a demographic (Republicans) that will never fucking support them. And, just like in 2016, they care more about the support of people who would never support them.
They lost because of it, and that's on them. The Democrats need to win voters to their party, and this bullshit Republican-lite "we're not fascist and we totally promise this time we'll actually make progress for realsies" isn't working anymore. I hope they choose to go progressive, but looks more like the Democrats will just shift further right, alienating more progressive voters and giving fascism a stronger foothold next election (assuming we have one).
You're so edgy, oh my gawdddddddddddddd
Y'know what... I started writing a whole thing out, and you're not worth it.
Fucking "Democrat" versus "Democratic," for fuck's sake, no wonder we lost.
Every Republican family member except one that I've asked about Bernie has said more or less the following:
I like him, I like that he's not Dem/Repub, he's got the country's best interest at heart, etc.
Then it's usually followed by how he'd never get a chance, and then it revolves back to why Dems suck and repubs rule, or at best, "they're both the same."
You are 100% right: people want change, they want progress, and regardless of how shitty he is, Trump got things done that his base wanted.
Clinton, then Biden, and now Harris, promise marginal improvements to the status quo while dismissing large swaths of their electorate that don't fall in line.
If they ran progressive candidates with progressive policies, they'd pull voters from all over. But they wont, hence, fascism.
A politicians job during a campaign is to convince people they are worth electing.
Harris lost the electoral college and the popular vote. Harris failed to convince a majority of the electorate that she was worth voting for. That's it, that's the whole story: she failed to win over voters, and failed to rally support from her own party.
She became Biden 2.0 as her campaign went on, and people didn't want four more years of Biden. She showed no meaningful difference between the current administration and her own should she win.
She lost Michigan by less than 100,000 votes. More than 100,000 people protest voted over Palestine during the primaries there. Harris took that information, and doubled down on Biden's policy, ignoring her constituents. The DNC welcomed numerous Republican officials to speak at the DNC, the same officials who helped Trump during his first presidency, they were welcomed with open arms. But no Palestinian Democrats, including those put forward by the Uncommitted Protest Vote Movement, were given time to speak at the DNC.
And as her campaign went on, she proved that was more concerned with trying to win over Republicans (like Hillary failed to do in 2016, and Biden failed to do in 2020) than she was trying to rally support from her own undecided voters and non-voters. Less than 40% of eligible voters vote, so her strategy was completely write off the 60% that could he won over, and focus on trying to win conservatives, which required more Centrist policies, which just alienates progressive Democrats...
Anyway, let's see, oh yeah: 94% of registered Republicans voted for Republicans in 2024, the exact same amount as 2020.
No one was duped, you sound weird and strange talking the way you do. It's off-putting and makes me want to actively work against Democracy, because you're doing exactly what I've been describing: dismissing everything I have to say while condescendingly speaking to me like I'm some misguided child.
You need grow up and accept that the Democrats fucked up, backed the wrong strategies, and were significantly more unpopular than they thought they were.
It is sad how quickly and easily you've fallen for the fallacy that it's not party leadership, but the voters they're supposed to represent and reflect that are the reason why Democrats can't fucking win. Absolutely delusional.