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tlou3please

@ tlou3please @lemmy.world

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107
Joined
1 yr. ago

  • [Mega thread] - Biden ends bid for presidency

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  • I'm not American but want to be in the loop. Media here is saying Kamala Harris is the likely successor. What do people think of her? Is she liked? I assume her actual politics are more or less the same since she was VP.

  • Trump Blows a Kiss as Hulk Hogan Rips His Shirt Onstage in Surreal RNC Scene

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  • Wtf did I just watch haha why the hell haven't I seen that before

  • 'We're close to the end': Biden world braces for the possibility that the president steps aside

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  • Worst theme park ever

  • JD Vance once wrote that he 'convinced myself that I was gay' when he was a kid

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  • Also, was this his grandmother saying that she knows that SHE'S straight because she wants to suck dick?

  • JD Vance once wrote that he 'convinced myself that I was gay' when he was a kid

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  • So, is he...

    1. Fundamentally misrepresenting homosexually as self delusion and a choice, or
    2. A closet homosexual in denial, like so many other homophobes

    I guess they're not mutually exclusive.

  • Jack Black axes tour over bandmate's Trump comment

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  • I don't think he's saying either are okay, just pointing out the double standard. That's how I read it anyway.

  • Jack Black axes tour over bandmate's Trump comment

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  • I don't think the comment was appropriate but I also don't think it was really necessary to cancel the tour over it. It was a joke made in poor taste. Worth an apology? Sure. But this seems like an overreaction.

  • Ex-Porsche Lawyer Sentenced After Throwing Her Newborn Out Window So It Wouldn't Disrupt Her Career

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  • Least psychopathic lawyer

  • Largest UK public sector trial of four-day week sees huge benefits, research finds

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  • These people will come round when nobody wants to work for them. Same thing happened/is happening with WFH and hybrid jobs.

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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  • I'll just start by saying I found your comment very interesting and insightful and I've learned a lot about the local challenges so thank you for taking the time to educate me. I still stand by my core argument but I appreciate your account and it was an interesting read.

    What I would add is that I think it's very easy to fall into the trap of judging all tourists by the loud ones. The vast majority are just trying to get some time away and enjoy some time abroad and do so respectfully. I'd respectfully disagree that they're the minority. Yeah, certain places get more tourists because the flights are cheap. Well, times are tough and I think less well-off people also deserve a holiday. It's not really their fault if some places are more affordable than others.

    Vacant holiday homes is a massive problem here as well, especially in regions like Cornwall and the Lake District. And also London, where the ultra wealthy of the world essentially use the city as a bank account to store their wealth. Personally I'm in favour of taxing the hell out them to disincentivise the practice and bring down house prices for genuine residents and families. But much like the tourism situation we've been discussing, it's such a huge source of income for the country that I don't envision this really happening. As much as I'd like it to.

    It's the job of politicians to resolve the systemic issues (though I don't pretend to know how). If they don't have a strong enough mandate to do so then, well, that's democracy isn't it? I say this as someone who about a week ago won the first vote of their adult voting life after a decade and a half living under a conservative government who I can't stand. By all means campaign and protest to support your cause for the next vote, but I continue to condemn the type of protest shown in the original post. I don't think it's right to form a mob around perceived-foreigners, chant at them and spray water at them - which is my core point I wanted to originally make.

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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    1. I think it's fair to say that football hooliganism is not unique to any particular place, and is a specific and unique problem. I do find football hooligans a nightmare. Is that the same problem as we're discussing with general tourism? I would argue no. Football hooligans are horrible in their own countries too.
    2. That's an absolutely perfect example of what I'm saying. Whose fault is that - the individual who goes to that place, or the local government for approving those businesses to set themselves up on that street? If I lived there I would be furious. Not with the tourist spending money there, but with government for enabling the situation.

    I've travelled around Spain and Italy (not Portugal, though I would love to visit one day) and I completely agree that it's a shame when places are taken over by businesses that cater to tourists to the detriment of the authentic local culture. The first place that comes to mind for me is Amalfi in Italy, where this was by far the worst part about my visit there, despite it being an absolutely gorgeous part of the world.

    Where we disagree is where the responsibility lies. I do not believe it's the fault of the individual tourist. Local and national governments absolutely have the ability to change the situation. Obviously they don't because tourism brings in so much money. I don't particularly see how accosting and blaming individuals who have come to visit achieves anything or places blame on the people whose literal job it is to regulate these things.

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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  • I admit I'm not familiar with Spanish law specifically. However I do have a legal background including a master's in international law and I'm fluent in Spanish. It appears that this very comfortably fits the definition for misdemeanor assault without injury, based on a quick skim. In any case, since you bring up common sense, I think common sense would suggest that spraying people with water who are minding their own business is something that would be prohibited in any country with a sensible legal system. And regardless, it clearly fits the common sense everyday usage of the word.

    Personally, if this happened to me, as an ex police officer who worked in London where the threat of acid attacks are very real, I would in the first instance be quite concerned, especially given my PTSD. I think in any civilised, peaceful country a person should be able to mind their own business without being accosted and having water sprayed on them because they look foreign. That shouldn't be controversial.

    As for your point on personal responsibility and your comparison with climate change - yes, I would apply the exact same logic there. It's the responsibility of the government to regulate the private sector to minimise environmental impact. I would equally criticise assaulting end consumers as a form of climate protest. Would you not? I assume your personal carbon footprint is 0 in that case.

    How do I suggest the government do it? I don't know. That's not my field. It probably would have some consequences yes - the same can be said for almost any government policy on almost anything. It's not relevant to my point, which is that it's not the fault of someone who goes to another country as a tourist. What's YOUR suggestion? Ban tourists? Continue to target them with harassment until your country is so hostile in accosting foreigners that nobody wants to go there? That's really a place you'd want to live?

    I was in Barcelona last November. I stayed in a hotel for a few days and visited a few sites, went to the theatre, and ate out at a few restaurants. I did that because I enjoy Spanish culture and Barcelona seems like an interesting place, and because I can. I deserved to be harassed and assaulted for that? Really? For visiting somewhere I find interesting, causing no harm to anyone, and spending money in local businesses?

    I'm not saying the people of Spain as a whole are xenophobic. I'm saying that these groups who assault and harass people in the streets because they think they're foreigners are xenophobic. That is a xenophobic attack. And you are currently advocating for it.

    I live in a coastal city and during the summer months it is PACKED with tourists from all kinds of countries. I get the annoyance. I experience it first hand. I empathise. But it does NOT warrant this kind of behaviour targeted towards people who are perceived as foreign. That's not how civilised societies do things. And I'm finding it a bit perplexing that you are simultaneously advocating for that while also talking about making decisions based on conscience.

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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  • I'm not muttering it. It's literally assault.

    "Knowingly going to a country suffering from over tourism" oh, please. None of those consequences you listed are any individual tourist's fault. If the government has failed to regulate these things that's on them.

    In any case, do the protestors know all of the people they assaulted individually? I somehow doubt it.

    Dress it up however you want, you are advocating for indiscriminate xenophobic assault and harassment.

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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  • Okay. Well I've been to plenty of capital and major cities in London and Barcelona is the only place I've ever seen anti tourist stuff around and heard about this in the media. Granted, I've not been to Lisbon.

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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  • Barcelona DOES have a unique reputation for these anti-tourist groups. That's why I said Barcelona was unique. But it's NOT unique in hosting large numbers of tourists. Not even close.

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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  • You are defending assaulting strangers who have done nothing.

    The internet is wild.

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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  • Yes. Downplay it all you want but it's still assault. Especially when acid attacks are not unheard of.

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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  • This justifies assaulting people how, exactly?

  • Barcelona anti-tourism protesters fire water pistols at visitors

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  • Climate protesters don't assault people who are just sitting down eating. It's not the same.

    (I actually would criticise those climate groups for separate reasons but that's a different conversation).