• x4740N@lemm.ee
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    2 months ago

    It always seems lime some excuse in a counter response by vеgаns

    The number of times I’ve responded to them telling them that plants probably process pain in a different way to us has always been shot down by them

    Tell them that brains extremely simplified are just on and off responses to certain stimuli / information just like plants have specific reponsonses to stimuli and computers having 1’s and 0’s that respond to information

    A mycelium network could be counted as a brain

    • BlackDragon@slrpnk.net
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      2 months ago

      If you actually believe harming plants causes them pain and that that is bad, you should be vegan. Animal agriculture harms far, far more plants than any plant agriculture ever could.

      • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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        2 months ago

        But then you’re still causing plants pain by farming and eating them. Isn’t that argument no different than saying if you believe that harming animals causes them pain, you should be in favor of eating the ones that are hunted because farming them causes more pain?

        I really don’t know if plants can cause pain and I think the environmental arguments for not eating meat are far more compelling than the ethical ones, but regardless, I think this is a poor argument for veganism.

        • BlackDragon@slrpnk.net
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          2 months ago

          But then you’re still causing plants pain by farming and eating them. Isn’t that argument no different than saying if you believe that harming animals causes them pain, you should be in favor of eating the ones that are hunted because farming them causes more pain?

          If you insist on animal abuse then you should do it through hunting rather than factory farming precisely because of the diminished amount of suffering caused. But it’s still more suffering than would be caused by just eating plants so I’m not sure I understand your point

          • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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            2 months ago

            I’m talking about an argument for veganism though. If you are saying that it’s acceptable for people to eat hunted meat, you’re not saying they should be vegans. And you’re encouraging a massive increase in hunting.

            • BlackDragon@slrpnk.net
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              2 months ago

              What part of my reference to it as animal abuse sounds like an endorsement of the practice? I’m not sure about you, but personally I consider animal abuse to be unacceptable.

              • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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                2 months ago

                Okay, then I think you’re completely missing my point, which is that arguing that causing less pain is good is a bad argument for veganism. Causing no pain would be the ethical argument, wouldn’t it? Causing less pain would still be unethical, right?

                It’s sort of like trying to convince someone committing genocide they should stop by telling them they should slow down.

                • flerp@lemm.ee
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                  2 months ago

                  It’s not sort of like that though because the practicality of the matter is that humans have to eat to survive but they don’t have to genocide to survive. Reducing suffering as much as possible being the goal rather than eliminating it completely is not a new concept in philosophy considering eliminating suffering completely is impossible.

                  • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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                    2 months ago

                    If it is only about reducing suffering as much as possible, would harvesting the meat from euthanized pets be acceptable?