Let me introduce you to the world of paraphrasing. That was the mantra, it has since pivoted to post-hoc scolding and gloating in the vein of: “I just fantasized about the republicans killing you”
Paraphrasing, eh? Neat world! Neat word too. But I have a quick question about this… paraphrasing world of yours:
“I just fantasized about the republicans killing you”
Can you tell me who exactly this phrase is para’d from? Did I say that right? Either way, if you can’t, well… that’s another lie you’ve been caught in, right? What would that be?
So, your example is some butt-hurt Hexbear mods that need to be introduced to the world of sarcasm?
And speaking of-
OMG! I honestly believed you though I didn’t know what paraphrasing meant!
/s
And for the record: Hexbear links aren’t going to be acceptable as evidence to anything other than proof that literacy isn’t an accurate representation of intelligence.
Provide something substantial. I promise I won’t ignore it. It’s not who I am. But if you’re going to try and use The Sorcerer’s Secret to prove that Harry Potter really exists…
While the democrats should have supported palestine, voting blue would have led to a favourable outcome anyway.
Not voting doesn’t help palestine whatsover. I get the arguments against lesser evil stuff, but its a bit easier to fix a broken system when the system isn’t dissappearing people.
I live in a state where her winning was a forgone conclusion, if I didn’t maybe I would have protested in another way. I’m not advocating for acceleration, the democrats are more an organization of managed decline, while Trump was clearly dead-set on kicking the leg out from under the table. I’m not interested in seeing it all fall apart, if anything I find that when I try to warn against what I think are the harmful decisions the Democrats make I get dismissed out of hand.
I will say that I am finding much higher frequency of people showing up to in person organizing in the last 3 months than in the last ~3 years under Biden.
That would be .world the entire last election year telling people to shut up about Palestine and vote blue
I’ll only speak for myself: I was extremely vocal about Palestine and the horror of the genocide there, while also recommending that people vote “blue” because Trump would make that genocide somehow even much worse while also adding many additional horrors to the world.
Absolutely nothing was solved simply by refusing to vote “blue.” The problems were made much worse. That is exactly why I was recommending to vote “blue,” to avoid that happening. This weird strawman where people didn’t care about Palestine, and that’s why they wanted Kamala Harris to win, is totally fucking weird.
Also, the people pointing out that the .ml general consensus view is completely fine with genocide when it’s happening in Ukraine or Xinjiang absolutely have a point. You’re not anti-imperialist, if you are generally in agreement with the .ml hivemind (I don’t know if you are or not, just going by other interactions with people there).
The people pointing out ‘the .ml general consensus’ by running a smear campaign are not exactly operating in good faith or opposed to imperialism, they just have a preferred team (the US + co).
From direct experience it’s not a monolith, earlier today I made a post on hex shitting on Putin with 50+ upvotes, I didn’t get banned for wrongthink yet and it’s not the first time.
Just don’t be weirdly xenophobic/misogynistic is more the vibe I’ve picked up on. I never understand when people go in looking for a fight or stir shit somewhere then act surprised when the response is to shut it down or mock them. I’ve had it happen to me plenty just for voicing my opinions earnestly in liberal spaces.
You may think that it speaks negatively of me if I’m more comfortable in the ‘tankie-run’ spaces as opposed to the liberal ones, but a large part of it is because they have a much lower tolerance for bigotry/misogyny/transphobia in general than the rest of lemmy and I’ve seen them actually attempting to address it when it’s brought up. (on hexbear at least, .ml is more of a boys club) I’ve even talked shit about one of the admins here for failing to address his transphobic comment history- as it stands if nutomic does ever post in /c/transgender it’s going to be a race between me and marcie to ban him from it.
So again, not a monolith.
re: voting, The democrats were acting unbelievably condescending from the start of the genocide, that the issue was going to go away in 6 months because people would forget. It may not seem like it to you, but from my position (and many others) it absolutely looks like they didn’t care and were telling people to shut up and get in line.
The people pointing out ‘the .ml general consensus’ by running a smear campaign are not exactly operating in good faith or opposed to imperialism, they just have a preferred team (the US + co).
100% of Hexbear users trying to justify Russia’s invasion, and saying that the US should cut off aid to motivate Ukraine to sue for peace (as if they’re somehow not “in favor” of peace, being the ones that got invaded.)
You might or might not agree with my take on the opinions presented there from the Hexbear side. But that unanimity of viciously imperialistic jingo in favor of Russia, combined with total disinterest in engaging about talking it through on the merits and demonstrating that their arguments are based in reality when someone disagrees with them, is what I was talking about.
I started here so as to get an understanding, going to remark on a few things I saw:
I don’t think this is them trolling you, (…)
spoiler
it reads like an earnest response and your reply looks like an overreaction. It just looks like you might have replied to the wrong person or misinterpreted the meaning of the comment? The comment reads to me as speculating on the reason for Trump flip-flopping, not making a value judgement besides calling the trade war with china ‘dumbfuck’
I’m actually primarily a .ml user, (…)
spoiler
I started using .ml because I like to get a variety of views and everyones propaganda for a given situation so that I can make my own critical assessment.
I do hang out in their comms and even help moderate one but I’ve pretty much only ever lurked there to get an idea for the vibes and it feels weird to be lumped in together as me representing them. Maybe if you frame it as they have an instance where they allow comments (like mine) made by reckless individuals (like me) to be made without moderation it would be more accurate.
Really not a fan of SA analogies being used frivolously tbh, but you do you- (…)
spoiler
The “answering questions” sticks out, because that’s what they’re referring to as JAQing off elsewhere- it’s not a hexbear specific term, nor is sealioning, that’s just internet slang. I didn’t see this thread posted anywhere else on hexbear to drive engagement, they just have relatively high traffic and users will be showing up in federated threads if they’re not browsing local.
I could just ignore it but I feel like that’s not the way. I don’t really feel like ceding the narrative space to them even if 99% of the people reading understand that they’re full of shit about it. I think most people have just moved on from wanting to engage with it.
I feel like this kind of tips your hand a bit for the engagement. I get the impulse to assume bad faith, I do it often and it’s something I’m working on tbh. Anyway, might be a moot point since you’re banned, I’ll get to this in the conclusion, but I think you were being overly confrontational, also going in treating this as a narrative space to be fought over going is probably why you’re going to get a response reflecting that.
Regarding viciously imperialistic jingo in favor of Russia: shelling donbass
spoiler
It is verifiable fact that the cities in the separatist region were getting routinely shelled basically since 2014, I for one recall constantly hearing about that in that time period unless your conclusion is that they deserved it or that it was just crisis actors or some influence campaign something. Either way it’s not jingoism to express that knowledge.
Regarding viciously imperialistic jingo in favor of Russia: opposition to NATO
spoiler
It’s a common anarchist/communist position in all sorts of countries to oppose military alliances like NATO, not an example of russian jingoism- but I would also agree with their assessment that this war has been the result of a protracted civil war that’s been happening since 2014. Post 2022 is that civil war bubbling over to include Russia directly.
Regarding viciously imperialistic jingo in favor of Russia: Self determination
spoiler
Forced conscription is wildly unpopular no matter where you are, it’s part of why people are opposed to wars in general.
“Nazi Government that the US props up”, “pogroms” from the previous comment- I want to link here this - Ukraine Found Complicit in 2014 Massacre By European Court of Human Rights I’ve just seen too many swastikas over the last 3 years to say this is anything but an unfair assessment.
Aren’t you in favor of self-determination? I really wish things had simply de-escalated and followed that track rather than this nightmare. Anyway, none of this is jingoim.
conclusion:
spoiler
I’m actually trying to be impartial, my takeaway is it looks like you’re just being overly antagonistic in the entire exchange. Your premise seems to be that they’re fostering an insular culture because they censor truth-speakers like yourself, let’s go back to the exchange that seemed to kick this off:
How Trump backed away from promising to end the Russia-Ukraine war in 24 hours
Ceasefires broadly speaking are going to be a process that’s going to involve violations on both sides due to all sorts of reason until the situation stabilizes, in this case via diplomatic solution hopefully.
Nakoiochi’s response is not jingoistic here either, I asked earlier in this essay if you support self-determination, you might also recognize that ‘going home’ might involve some staying to protect the separatist republics.
I might as well address the ban here too:
spoiler
I frankly found your iran/north korea comment in the log very hard to parse in the first place, but I did want to raise this exchange:
I get that this was sort of a low energy back and forth jab, but the reason they clapped you was because you basically jumped to (in slightly more elegant words) saying “what are you RUSSIAN?” at someone giving you a goad, and then it kind of spiraled after.
re: calling someone Russian for naysaying you-
Among Russians, we’re not all going to have the same opinions, there’s plenty of Russians (expats in particular) who would tow a line which conforms a lot more towards yours for example. There’s no need to start calling out ethnic groups just because you feel like you’re in a propaganda space that you need to defend. That’s my read on why they responded with a ban, I will grant it’s a bit heavy handed considering it’s an offsite comment.
From what I’ve gathered in my time is there’s a lot of Americans on the site rather than Russians. They have a lot of people on the site who are more interested in curating a comfortable space rather than having an active presence in this ‘propaganda space’ and would prefer continued defederation- they said as much in the last federation referendum, I don’t think there’s a coordinated propaganda effort at play.
I hope you enjoy my lengthy responses, I tried to summarize it from my reading and for what it’s worth I tried to approach it as impartially as I could given the circumstances.
I won’t speak for you specifically, since we’ve never interacted, but we both know ML’s management are openly supportive of imperialism and genocide.
You call LW users nazis, but you are more than happy to affiliate with a group that supports russian genocidal imperialism, knowingly lies about the attrocities commited by the russians and openly cheers for the russian army.
openly supportive of russian genocidal imperialism
failing to carry water for the US consensus narrative on all events related to geopolitics does not mean that people automatically support the geopolitical enemies to the fullest extent.
thank you for the “radio free Europe” article I will file that away with the rest of the high quality journalism.
Tankie scum are so predictable. You’re so tied to your CIA/BIA narrative that you can’t even think straight. The RFE article cites internal russian judicial decisions which can be further cross-referenced by russian propaganda.
Or are you saying the BIA hacked russian propaganda sources and russian judicial rulings in order to “make the RFE article seem more real”?
I most certainly do not. You seem primed to construe anything that’s not absolute demonization as support though.
Don’t lie. Tankie scum denies russian atrocities in Ukraine. “Bucha never happened, tens of thousands of Ukrainian civilians aren’t held in concentration camps in occupied territories, Ukrainian language and culture aren’t prosecuted in occupied territories.” I’ve had multiple tankie roaches tell me this on Lemmy.
But the worst part is that you do this merely due to internet roleplay reasons. You don’t speak russian, you don’t speak Ukrainian. You’ve never lived in russia, you’ve never lived in Ukraine.
You couldn’t even use common sense to figure out that stating “BIA wrote that fake article” logically does not work (even if you are a tankie), because you can cross validate it in 30 seconds via a russian language search that clearly shows russian propaganda channels saying the same thing as RFE (and you can even find the formal russian judicial ruling on government websites).
Let’s hope Russell Bentley’s learning experience is something you and other tankie scum will experience as well!
I was just mocking the source because it’s just a window into how you engage with the world. My dismissive response was because you felt the need to wish the same fate upon me simply by your association.
I’m not denying the story at all, The reporting has been circulating for a while. It was a fucked up situation and the way you revel in it is gross, makes all of your accusations feel more like projections.
But the worst part is that you do this merely due to internet roleplay reason. You don’t speak russian, you don’t speak Ukrainian. You’ve never lived in russia, you’ve never in Ukraine.
I do have family there and I’ve visited dozens of times over the years. I’m not interested in potentially doxxing myself though, I also have nothing to prove to you. You can continue to believe whatever you want about me, you seem content to believe whatever makes you feel comfortable anyways.
tankie scum
tankie roaches
this kinda talk just makes you just sound like a nazi who’s found a way to hang out in liberal spaces by vocally hating the people they hate
It’s not a window into how I engage with the world. It’s an article. How you reacted to it is clearly a window into your world (no one is buying your mea culpa).
So you are vatnik in addition to being a tankie? Worst of both worlds. And a foreign vatnik to boot as well! Those are the most entertaining ones.
Here you go again with your standard tankie polemic copytext. I am not American, in Europe “liberal” means something different.
It is fair and just to wish harm on people who are committed to bring death and suffering to your family, to your fellow citizens. I will note throughout this whole conversation you never once made any kind of statement that perhaps the russian are doing bad things. I wonder why this would be the case?
Don’t start with your projection BS.
We both saw that you randomly fantasized about killing some random internet user with an ice pick.
Unlike you, I am not hiding behind anything and playing dumb. You and your tankie scum support genocide and wish me and my family and fellow citizens harm.
As a result, I wish that you and other tankie scum like you end up like the Donbas cowboy.
What exactly am I projecting here? Be clear and specific, don’t play dumb.
As I said, earlier let’s hope Russell Bentley’s learning experience is something you and other tankie scum will experience as well!
We both saw that you randomly fantasized about killing some random internet user with an ice pick.
the same user admitted to being a jerk in the exchange as well, and not proud of their behavior in the runup to that very response. As far as I’m concerned that has been reconciled, even if we disagree.
You and your tankie scum support genocide and wish me and my family and fellow citizens harm.
I’m an anarchist, you are the one who declare me a tankie because at the end it’s just a pejorative, like calling me a slur. You then go on contriving positions for me to hold on your mind.
re: calling me vatnik, I find jingoism from any direction off-putting, but go off.
What exactly am I projecting here?
as I said in my previous post, you seem like a Nazi who has latched onto the appropriate targets for the company you keep
other than when it comes time to shut down bigotry
I came into hexbear disagreeing with something or other that got posted, and then started talking about Biden when someone brought him up. They threatened to kill me, threatened to stab me with an icepick, sent me shit pictures, and then banned me. This whole “they’re open to dissent, just not bigotry” is about as convincing as a MAGA person saying “we allow everyone, just not trolls” and then throwing a total unhinged wobbler if anyone ever disagrees with them and then banning the person for “trolling” saying they must have been inviting the wobbler by disagreeing.
It’s a standard playbook for fig-leaf-justifying censoring a space. It actually really works well for producing a bizarre echo-chamber which doesn’t really understand what anyone outside the echo chamber believes.
If your forum allows polite dissent from people on the team, but gives some of the most aggressive hostility and bans I’ve ever seen to anyone who actually disagrees, just say so and own it. Don’t do this bullshit of pretending it is something else.
I went and checked, was it on this account? The only thing I see in their modlog is you got a comment removed- this one:
and like I agree with removing that, it just looks like you’re doing this:
You didn’t even get banned.
Like I’ve actually tried looking up every time I see someone complaining about draconian mod actions and more often then not it’s something that just someone stirring shit and getting their wrist slapped, rather than the free speech 1984 gulag that they go on to complain about elsewhere.
My whole instance is defederated from Hexbear as far as I can tell. I can’t quite make sense of what shows in their “instances” page, but I’m not in “allowed.” Also, entertainingly enough they are apparently happy to make use of my RSS feed communities from rss.ponder.cat, although apparently totally uninterested in the actual news contained there. No one is subscribed to anything except for hackaday.
Here, look at this: https://ponder.cat/c/art@hexbear.net – I am subscribed, but it hasn’t updated in 6 months ever since I participated in that thread.
As I explained in that thread when someone sent me that same picture, I am not at all fantasizing about Trump sending pro-Palestinian or pro-migrant people to concentration camps. I’m not by any means happy about it. That’s why I tried to stop it from happening and was alarmed when they were uninterested in one particular way of stopping it. Surely that makes sense? Or yes it does, or no?
weird, your instance is not defederated on the hexbear side, not sure what’s going on there, it definitely looks like you aren’t getting posts.
As I explained in that thread when someone sent me that same picture, I am not at all fantasizing about Trump sending pro-Palestinian or pro-migrant people to concentration camps. I’m not by any means happy about it.
I get that, but you can see how someone could read that and feel like that’s what you were saying?
That’s why I tried to stop it from happening and was alarmed when they were uninterested in one particular way of stopping it.
All 80+ mil people who didn’t vote aren’t on lemmy. Some powerless online anarchists/communists failing to tow the line on shit isn’t why the ruling party essentially got swept in an incumbent election. I voted in a blue state for the communist because I agree with what they had to say about things more than I do Democrats or Republicans. It had objectively no impact. Maybe if more of the Democrats who feel as strongly as you fell into line with me instead we could actually be in a position to be using this horrifying war machine for something positive.
I know they recently voted to switch to allowlist, I have no visibility if they were blocked in the past either way they are on the allow list now and not blocked, not sure what else could be going wrong.
That would be .world the entire last election year telling people to shut up about Palestine and vote blue
I’m an anarchist, I don’t ‘support’ any of these parties beyond having a cautious optimism seeing China execute billionaires who misbehave.
Not a single person said that.
Let me introduce you to the world of paraphrasing. That was the mantra, it has since pivoted to post-hoc scolding and gloating in the vein of: “I just fantasized about the republicans killing you”
Paraphrasing, eh? Neat world! Neat word too. But I have a quick question about this… paraphrasing world of yours:
Can you tell me who exactly this phrase is para’d from? Did I say that right? Either way, if you can’t, well… that’s another lie you’ve been caught in, right? What would that be?
Three in this thread alone?
That one came from this- https://hexbear.net/modlog?page=1&actionType=All&userId=1765223
It looked enough like gloating about the situation to piss people off:
https://hexbear.net/comment/5568891
“let me introduce you to the world of paraphrasing” I meant it as world; like I’m introducing an entirely new concept to you, rather than just a word.
So, your example is some butt-hurt Hexbear mods that need to be introduced to the world of sarcasm?
And speaking of-
OMG! I honestly believed you though I didn’t know what paraphrasing meant!
/s
And for the record: Hexbear links aren’t going to be acceptable as evidence to anything other than proof that literacy isn’t an accurate representation of intelligence.
lol any more requirements officer?
you want my papers?
if you’re just going to ignore anything I do provide and call me a liar I’m not gonna be motivated to engage in good faith.
honestly not sure what you’re even trying to say anymore
Provide something substantial. I promise I won’t ignore it. It’s not who I am. But if you’re going to try and use The Sorcerer’s Secret to prove that Harry Potter really exists…
I am going to doubt you.
While the democrats should have supported palestine, voting blue would have led to a favourable outcome anyway.
Not voting doesn’t help palestine whatsover. I get the arguments against lesser evil stuff, but its a bit easier to fix a broken system when the system isn’t dissappearing people.
I live in a state where her winning was a forgone conclusion, if I didn’t maybe I would have protested in another way. I’m not advocating for acceleration, the democrats are more an organization of managed decline, while Trump was clearly dead-set on kicking the leg out from under the table. I’m not interested in seeing it all fall apart, if anything I find that when I try to warn against what I think are the harmful decisions the Democrats make I get dismissed out of hand.
I will say that I am finding much higher frequency of people showing up to in person organizing in the last 3 months than in the last ~3 years under Biden.
Well, there is a lot more to protest now with Trump.
It is annoying for people to dismiss any critisism against the democrats. Some people think they are a perfect, flawless party.
I’ll only speak for myself: I was extremely vocal about Palestine and the horror of the genocide there, while also recommending that people vote “blue” because Trump would make that genocide somehow even much worse while also adding many additional horrors to the world.
Absolutely nothing was solved simply by refusing to vote “blue.” The problems were made much worse. That is exactly why I was recommending to vote “blue,” to avoid that happening. This weird strawman where people didn’t care about Palestine, and that’s why they wanted Kamala Harris to win, is totally fucking weird.
Also, the people pointing out that the .ml general consensus view is completely fine with genocide when it’s happening in Ukraine or Xinjiang absolutely have a point. You’re not anti-imperialist, if you are generally in agreement with the .ml hivemind (I don’t know if you are or not, just going by other interactions with people there).
The people pointing out ‘the .ml general consensus’ by running a smear campaign are not exactly operating in good faith or opposed to imperialism, they just have a preferred team (the US + co).
From direct experience it’s not a monolith, earlier today I made a post on hex shitting on Putin with 50+ upvotes, I didn’t get banned for wrongthink yet and it’s not the first time.
Just don’t be weirdly xenophobic/misogynistic is more the vibe I’ve picked up on. I never understand when people go in looking for a fight or stir shit somewhere then act surprised when the response is to shut it down or mock them. I’ve had it happen to me plenty just for voicing my opinions earnestly in liberal spaces.
You may think that it speaks negatively of me if I’m more comfortable in the ‘tankie-run’ spaces as opposed to the liberal ones, but a large part of it is because they have a much lower tolerance for bigotry/misogyny/transphobia in general than the rest of lemmy and I’ve seen them actually attempting to address it when it’s brought up. (on hexbear at least, .ml is more of a boys club) I’ve even talked shit about one of the admins here for failing to address his transphobic comment history- as it stands if nutomic does ever post in /c/transgender it’s going to be a race between me and marcie to ban him from it.
So again, not a monolith.
re: voting, The democrats were acting unbelievably condescending from the start of the genocide, that the issue was going to go away in 6 months because people would forget. It may not seem like it to you, but from my position (and many others) it absolutely looks like they didn’t care and were telling people to shut up and get in line.
Here’s the kind of thing I was talking about:
https://ponder.cat/post/2492263
100% of Hexbear users trying to justify Russia’s invasion, and saying that the US should cut off aid to motivate Ukraine to sue for peace (as if they’re somehow not “in favor” of peace, being the ones that got invaded.)
You might or might not agree with my take on the opinions presented there from the Hexbear side. But that unanimity of viciously imperialistic jingo in favor of Russia, combined with total disinterest in engaging about talking it through on the merits and demonstrating that their arguments are based in reality when someone disagrees with them, is what I was talking about.
I started here so as to get an understanding, going to remark on a few things I saw:
I don’t think this is them trolling you, (…)
spoiler
it reads like an earnest response and your reply looks like an overreaction. It just looks like you might have replied to the wrong person or misinterpreted the meaning of the comment? The comment reads to me as speculating on the reason for Trump flip-flopping, not making a value judgement besides calling the trade war with china ‘dumbfuck’
I’m actually primarily a .ml user, (…)
spoiler
I started using .ml because I like to get a variety of views and everyones propaganda for a given situation so that I can make my own critical assessment.
I do hang out in their comms and even help moderate one but I’ve pretty much only ever lurked there to get an idea for the vibes and it feels weird to be lumped in together as me representing them. Maybe if you frame it as they have an instance where they allow comments (like mine) made by reckless individuals (like me) to be made without moderation it would be more accurate.
Really not a fan of SA analogies being used frivolously tbh, but you do you- (…)
spoiler
The “answering questions” sticks out, because that’s what they’re referring to as JAQing off elsewhere- it’s not a hexbear specific term, nor is sealioning, that’s just internet slang. I didn’t see this thread posted anywhere else on hexbear to drive engagement, they just have relatively high traffic and users will be showing up in federated threads if they’re not browsing local.
I feel like this kind of tips your hand a bit for the engagement. I get the impulse to assume bad faith, I do it often and it’s something I’m working on tbh. Anyway, might be a moot point since you’re banned, I’ll get to this in the conclusion, but I think you were being overly confrontational, also going in treating this as a narrative space to be fought over going is probably why you’re going to get a response reflecting that.
Regarding viciously imperialistic jingo in favor of Russia: shelling donbass
spoiler
It is verifiable fact that the cities in the separatist region were getting routinely shelled basically since 2014, I for one recall constantly hearing about that in that time period unless your conclusion is that they deserved it or that it was just crisis actors or some influence campaign something. Either way it’s not jingoism to express that knowledge.
Regarding viciously imperialistic jingo in favor of Russia: opposition to NATO
spoiler
It’s a common anarchist/communist position in all sorts of countries to oppose military alliances like NATO, not an example of russian jingoism- but I would also agree with their assessment that this war has been the result of a protracted civil war that’s been happening since 2014. Post 2022 is that civil war bubbling over to include Russia directly.
Regarding viciously imperialistic jingo in favor of Russia: Self determination
spoiler
Forced conscription is wildly unpopular no matter where you are, it’s part of why people are opposed to wars in general. “Nazi Government that the US props up”, “pogroms” from the previous comment- I want to link here this - Ukraine Found Complicit in 2014 Massacre By European Court of Human Rights I’ve just seen too many swastikas over the last 3 years to say this is anything but an unfair assessment.
Aren’t you in favor of self-determination? I really wish things had simply de-escalated and followed that track rather than this nightmare. Anyway, none of this is jingoim.
conclusion:
spoiler
I’m actually trying to be impartial, my takeaway is it looks like you’re just being overly antagonistic in the entire exchange. Your premise seems to be that they’re fostering an insular culture because they censor truth-speakers like yourself, let’s go back to the exchange that seemed to kick this off:
Ceasefires broadly speaking are going to be a process that’s going to involve violations on both sides due to all sorts of reason until the situation stabilizes, in this case via diplomatic solution hopefully.
Nakoiochi’s response is not jingoistic here either, I asked earlier in this essay if you support self-determination, you might also recognize that ‘going home’ might involve some staying to protect the separatist republics.
I might as well address the ban here too:
spoiler
I frankly found your iran/north korea comment in the log very hard to parse in the first place, but I did want to raise this exchange:
I get that this was sort of a low energy back and forth jab, but the reason they clapped you was because you basically jumped to (in slightly more elegant words) saying “what are you RUSSIAN?” at someone giving you a goad, and then it kind of spiraled after.
re: calling someone Russian for naysaying you-
Among Russians, we’re not all going to have the same opinions, there’s plenty of Russians (expats in particular) who would tow a line which conforms a lot more towards yours for example. There’s no need to start calling out ethnic groups just because you feel like you’re in a propaganda space that you need to defend. That’s my read on why they responded with a ban, I will grant it’s a bit heavy handed considering it’s an offsite comment.
From what I’ve gathered in my time is there’s a lot of Americans on the site rather than Russians. They have a lot of people on the site who are more interested in curating a comfortable space rather than having an active presence in this ‘propaganda space’ and would prefer continued defederation- they said as much in the last federation referendum, I don’t think there’s a coordinated propaganda effort at play.
I hope you enjoy my lengthy responses, I tried to summarize it from my reading and for what it’s worth I tried to approach it as impartially as I could given the circumstances.
I won’t speak for you specifically, since we’ve never interacted, but we both know ML’s management are openly supportive of imperialism and genocide.
You call LW users nazis, but you are more than happy to affiliate with a group that supports russian genocidal imperialism, knowingly lies about the attrocities commited by the russians and openly cheers for the russian army.
failing to carry water for the US consensus narrative on all events related to geopolitics does not mean that people automatically support the geopolitical enemies to the fullest extent.
I outlined my position in the other reply, these servers are not really a monolith other than when it comes time to shut down bigotry
You talk big, yet you wish death to Ukrainians and cheer for russians to capture Ukrainian territory and eradicate Ukrainian culture.
You’re not fooling anyone.
EDIT: Since you’re fine with ice pick murder fantasies, let me say the following:
I do hope one day you and your fellow tankies get to experience the life of “Donbas Cowboy”, Russell Bentley.
Just imagine what was going through his mind in those last moments.
re: death threat, For the record, I apologized to the guy and he accepted it.
I most certainly do not. You seem primed to construe anything that’s not absolute demonization as support though.
thank you for the “radio free Europe” article I will file that away with the rest of the high quality journalism.
Tankie scum are so predictable. You’re so tied to your CIA/BIA narrative that you can’t even think straight. The RFE article cites internal russian judicial decisions which can be further cross-referenced by russian propaganda.
Or are you saying the BIA hacked russian propaganda sources and russian judicial rulings in order to “make the RFE article seem more real”?
Don’t lie. Tankie scum denies russian atrocities in Ukraine. “Bucha never happened, tens of thousands of Ukrainian civilians aren’t held in concentration camps in occupied territories, Ukrainian language and culture aren’t prosecuted in occupied territories.” I’ve had multiple tankie roaches tell me this on Lemmy.
But the worst part is that you do this merely due to internet roleplay reasons. You don’t speak russian, you don’t speak Ukrainian. You’ve never lived in russia, you’ve never lived in Ukraine.
You couldn’t even use common sense to figure out that stating “BIA wrote that fake article” logically does not work (even if you are a tankie), because you can cross validate it in 30 seconds via a russian language search that clearly shows russian propaganda channels saying the same thing as RFE (and you can even find the formal russian judicial ruling on government websites).
Let’s hope Russell Bentley’s learning experience is something you and other tankie scum will experience as well!
What is BIA in this context?
I was just mocking the source because it’s just a window into how you engage with the world. My dismissive response was because you felt the need to wish the same fate upon me simply by your association.
I’m not denying the story at all, The reporting has been circulating for a while. It was a fucked up situation and the way you revel in it is gross, makes all of your accusations feel more like projections.
I do have family there and I’ve visited dozens of times over the years. I’m not interested in potentially doxxing myself though, I also have nothing to prove to you. You can continue to believe whatever you want about me, you seem content to believe whatever makes you feel comfortable anyways.
this kinda talk just makes you just sound like a nazi who’s found a way to hang out in liberal spaces by vocally hating the people they hate
It’s not a window into how I engage with the world. It’s an article. How you reacted to it is clearly a window into your world (no one is buying your mea culpa).
So you are vatnik in addition to being a tankie? Worst of both worlds. And a foreign vatnik to boot as well! Those are the most entertaining ones.
Here you go again with your standard tankie polemic copytext. I am not American, in Europe “liberal” means something different.
It is fair and just to wish harm on people who are committed to bring death and suffering to your family, to your fellow citizens. I will note throughout this whole conversation you never once made any kind of statement that perhaps the russian are doing bad things. I wonder why this would be the case?
Don’t start with your projection BS.
We both saw that you randomly fantasized about killing some random internet user with an ice pick.
Unlike you, I am not hiding behind anything and playing dumb. You and your tankie scum support genocide and wish me and my family and fellow citizens harm.
As a result, I wish that you and other tankie scum like you end up like the Donbas cowboy.
What exactly am I projecting here? Be clear and specific, don’t play dumb.
As I said, earlier let’s hope Russell Bentley’s learning experience is something you and other tankie scum will experience as well!
the same user admitted to being a jerk in the exchange as well, and not proud of their behavior in the runup to that very response. As far as I’m concerned that has been reconciled, even if we disagree.
I’m an anarchist, you are the one who declare me a tankie because at the end it’s just a pejorative, like calling me a slur. You then go on contriving positions for me to hold on your mind.
re: calling me vatnik, I find jingoism from any direction off-putting, but go off.
as I said in my previous post, you seem like a Nazi who has latched onto the appropriate targets for the company you keep
I came into hexbear disagreeing with something or other that got posted, and then started talking about Biden when someone brought him up. They threatened to kill me, threatened to stab me with an icepick, sent me shit pictures, and then banned me. This whole “they’re open to dissent, just not bigotry” is about as convincing as a MAGA person saying “we allow everyone, just not trolls” and then throwing a total unhinged wobbler if anyone ever disagrees with them and then banning the person for “trolling” saying they must have been inviting the wobbler by disagreeing.
It’s a standard playbook for fig-leaf-justifying censoring a space. It actually really works well for producing a bizarre echo-chamber which doesn’t really understand what anyone outside the echo chamber believes.
If your forum allows polite dissent from people on the team, but gives some of the most aggressive hostility and bans I’ve ever seen to anyone who actually disagrees, just say so and own it. Don’t do this bullshit of pretending it is something else.
I went and checked, was it on this account? The only thing I see in their modlog is you got a comment removed- this one:
and like I agree with removing that, it just looks like you’re doing this:
You didn’t even get banned.
Like I’ve actually tried looking up every time I see someone complaining about draconian mod actions and more often then not it’s something that just someone stirring shit and getting their wrist slapped, rather than the free speech 1984 gulag that they go on to complain about elsewhere.
My whole instance is defederated from Hexbear as far as I can tell. I can’t quite make sense of what shows in their “instances” page, but I’m not in “allowed.” Also, entertainingly enough they are apparently happy to make use of my RSS feed communities from rss.ponder.cat, although apparently totally uninterested in the actual news contained there. No one is subscribed to anything except for hackaday.
Here, look at this: https://ponder.cat/c/art@hexbear.net – I am subscribed, but it hasn’t updated in 6 months ever since I participated in that thread.
As I explained in that thread when someone sent me that same picture, I am not at all fantasizing about Trump sending pro-Palestinian or pro-migrant people to concentration camps. I’m not by any means happy about it. That’s why I tried to stop it from happening and was alarmed when they were uninterested in one particular way of stopping it. Surely that makes sense? Or yes it does, or no?
weird, your instance is not defederated on the hexbear side, not sure what’s going on there, it definitely looks like you aren’t getting posts.
I get that, but you can see how someone could read that and feel like that’s what you were saying?
All 80+ mil people who didn’t vote aren’t on lemmy. Some powerless online anarchists/communists failing to tow the line on shit isn’t why the ruling party essentially got swept in an incumbent election. I voted in a blue state for the communist because I agree with what they had to say about things more than I do Democrats or Republicans. It had objectively no impact. Maybe if more of the Democrats who feel as strongly as you fell into line with me instead we could actually be in a position to be using this horrifying war machine for something positive.
I thought hexbear used an allowlist rather than a blocklist, but could be wrong about that.
I know they recently voted to switch to allowlist, I have no visibility if they were blocked in the past either way they are on the allow list now and not blocked, not sure what else could be going wrong.